TRANSCRIPT One Bad Mother Episode 447: Theresa Goes Out For Milk

00:00:00

Gabe Mara

Producer

Hi! It’s producer Gabe. Due to the special nature of today’s show, we are putting the amazing details of our show supporters at the start of the show. Thank you!

00:00:09

Music

Promo

Cheerful ukulele with whistling plays in background.

00:00:10

Biz Ellis

Promo

One Bad Mother is supported in part by Dipsea. Dipsea Stories is an app full of sexy audio stories and now they even have brand-new written stories, if using your eyes is what you’re into. [Laughs.] Speaking of eyes—close your eyes and let yourself get lost in a world where only good things happen and pleasure is your only priority. And if that could be a motto for, like, parents everywhere—it should be. I love the Dipsea Stories. First of all, they’re short. I can also set my preferences so I don’t get anything that totally surprises me or is not what I’m into. And it’s just a little treat! For myself! For listeners of the show, Dipsea is offering an extended 30-day free trial when you go to DipseaStories.com/badmother. That’s 30 days of full access for free when you go to D-I-P-S-E-AStories.com/badmother. That’s DipseaStories.com/badmother. 

[Music fades out.]

00:01:21

Promo

Clip

Music: Cheerful, swinging music plays briefly.

Ross: Carrie, is it?

Carrie: Oh yes, hi, I’m Carrie.

Ross: I am psychic Ross, and I will be reading you this evening.

Carrie: Oh! Interesting! Well, okay. I cohost a podcast. It’s called Oh No, Ross & Carrie—

Ross: Yes, I’m sensing that. The spirits are telling me it is a show about—

00:01:38

Promo

Crosstalk

Ross: —poodles. Yes. That’s correct. And you—

Carrie: Well, it’s about like fringe science and spirituality and claims of the paranormal. Oh, you knew that!

00:01:43

Promo

Clip

Ross: —do research online. You—

Carrie: But more importantly we do, like, in-person investigations.

Ross: In-person investigate as well. 

Carrie: Yeah. Oh my god! That’s amazing!
 

Ross: See?
 

Carrie: Me and my friend—this is so weird—my friend Ross, same name as you—

Ross: Weird.

Carrie: He and I just go and try them all out! And actually we’ve gone to a number of psychics, and to be honest with you, it’s a lot like this. 

[Music starts up again.]

Carrie: It’s called Oh No, Ross and Carrie. They can find it at MaximumFun.org.

Ross: I could’ve told you that. 

00:02:07

Music

Promo

Inspirational keyboard music plays in background.

00:02:08

Biz

Promo

One Bad Mother is supported in part by Storyworth. No matter how well you know somebody, they always have fascinating stories that you haven’t heard before. Storyworth is an online service that helps you and your loved ones connect through sharing stories and memories, and preserves them for years to come. Every week, Storyworth emails your loved one a thought-provoking question of your choice from a vast pool of possible options. I gave this subscription to both of my parents, and it was really fun to find out stories that, y’know, don’t come up around the holiday table. Get to know your loved ones better and preserve those special moments forever with Storyworth! Right now for a limited time, you can save $10 on your first purchase when you go to Storyworth.com/badmother. That’s S-T-O-R-Y-W-O-R-T-H.com/badmother to save $10 on your first purchase. Storyworth.com/badmother. 

[Music fades out.]

00:03:13

Promo

Clip

Music: Sophisticated electronic/string music.

Teresa McElroy: Shmanners. Noun. Definition: rules of etiquette designed not to judge others, but rather to guide ourselves through everyday social situations.

[Music stops.]

Travis McElroy: Hello, internet! I’m your husband host, Travis McElroy.

Teresa: And I’m your wife host, Teresa McElroy.

Travis: Every week on Shmanners, we take a look at a topic that has to do with society or manners. We talk about the history of it. We take a look at how it applies to everyday life. And we take some of your questions. And sometimes, we do a biography about a really cool person that had an impact on how we view etiquette.

[Music fades back in.]

Travis: So, join us every Friday and listen to Shmanners on MaximumFun.org, or wherever podcasts are found.

Teresa: Manners shmanners. Get it?

[Music ends on a bright chord.]

00:03:56

Biz 

Host

Hi. I’m Biz.

00:03:57

Theresa Thorn

Host

And I’m Theresa.

00:03:59

Biz 

Host

Due to the pandemic, we bring you One Bad Mother straight from our homes—including such interruptions as: children! Animal noises! And more! So let’s all get a little closer while we have to be so far apart. And remember—we are doing a good job.

00:04:17

Music

Music

“Summon the Rawk” by Kevin MacLeod. Driving electric guitar and heavy drums.

[Continues through dialogue.]

00:04:22

Biz 

Host

This week on One Bad Mother—Theresa goes out for milk. 

00:04:28

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: Woo! [Laughs.] 

Theresa: Are we gonna—[Laughs.] 

Both: Woooo! 

00:04:40

Biz 

Host

A little rusty! We’ve gotten a little rusty there! Is what we’ve done. Hi, Theresa!

00:04:46

Theresa 

Host

Hi, Biz! 

00:04:48

Biz 

Host

Um… yeah. How—how are ya? [Laughs.] 

00:04:51

Theresa 

Host

Oh my god. Um… this chihuahua in my lap—

00:04:55

Biz 

Host

Yeah, you have a chihuahua.

00:04:57

Theresa 

Host

Is—is coregulating with me? And… without this dog, I would probably just be crying buckets of tears right now.

00:05:08

Biz 

Host

Yeah. And it’s not because Theresa has stubbed their toe. 

[Theresa laughs.] 

It is because… [Laughs.] You guys may have noticed that Theresa hasn’t necessarily been on the show as much.

00:05:23

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. I’ve been busy getting milk.

00:05:26

Biz 

Host

You’ve been getting a lot of milk. I mean—

00:05:29

Theresa 

Host

I just keep going to the corner store and then once I get there, it’s really hard for me to find my way back. 

[Biz laughs.] 

00:05:38

Biz 

Host

It’s not even like a forest that’s hard to navigate anymore, if we wanna reference back to our very first shows. It’s more of like… an inconvenience store—

[Theresa laughs.] 

—of trying to get back. I think it’s fair to say that the pandemic was fairly dysregulating. For your family. And for you.

00:05:59

Theresa 

Host

Yes. Yeah. Things really have not—

[Biz laughs.] 

—been the same since. I’m sure that’s true for a lot of people? But yeah. Things have not—things have not been the same. And… there’s no, like, “Oh, but once this happens, then… whatever.” Now—

00:06:20

Biz 

Host

Can I tell you how disappointing that is? I mean, not just in a selfish way for me. But I think there’s such a reality about that line applying to so many different circumstances. “Once this happens, then I’ll…”

00:06:36

Theresa 

Host

If I could just, then that—then it’ll be—yeah.

00:06:40

Biz  

Host

When this does that, I’ll do—

00:06:45

Theresa 

Host

Fill-in-the-blank.

00:06:47

Biz 

Host

Yeah. And so with great consideration—

00:06:51

Theresa 

Host

Yeah!

00:06:52

Biz 

Host

Do I say it? Or do you say it?

00:06:56

Theresa 

Host

I feel like I would love for you to say it? But it’s my job to say it.

[Biz laughs.] 

00:07:02

Biz  

Host

That’s okay! I do everybody’s fucking job around here. It’s alright!

00:07:05

Theresa 

Host

As you started going into it I was like, “Oh, is she gonna just do this for me?” But no. I think—I think I need to say… that… Biz is my favorite person. And the most—stop making a weird face at me. The most—

00:07:24

Biz 

Host

Sorry. I’m making a weird face at Gabe. It just happens to be that you could see it. It’s my pouty face. 

[Theresa laughs.] 

Okay, go ahead.

00:07:33

Theresa 

Host

It’s my, “I don’t wanna receive a compliment right now!”

00:07:36

Biz 

Host

Oh, no! It was the “I don’t wanna hear what comes after the compliment! I don’t want the ‘but.’” But go ahead.

00:07:40

Theresa 

Host

Got it. Got it, got it, got it.

00:07:41

Biz 

Host

Go back to complimenting me. I’ve gotten very good at receiving them.

00:07:44

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. So, I mean… It’s—I haven’t been here in a long time. And I keep thinking I’m gonna come back. And I came to the conclusion that I—I’m really not coming back. 

[Pause.] 

It’s—it’s hard, but hard doesn’t really describe it. It’s… very disorienting. As we alluded to before, the feeling that once things are—[Laughs.] Once things are normal and things are under control, I’ll come back? Is a very calming thought. Whether it’s true or not. It’s a very, like, comforting feeling to say, like, “That’s gonna happen. Y’know. I don’t have the timeline for it yet, but it’s going to happen.”

00:08:33

Biz 

Host

It’s a lie that hugs you.

00:08:36

Theresa 

Host

It is! It’s a lie that hugs you. 

00:08:37

Biz 

Host

It’s a hugging lie. [Laughs.] 

00:08:38

Theresa 

Host

And for a while, y’know, wasn’t a lie. For a while it—it made sense. And then as time has gone on, I’ve just realized that—it’s really just not what’s happening right now. In my life. And so… I wanted to come here and share that with you, our amazing audience. Biz has known for maybe a week. Hasn’t been that long.

00:09:05

Biz 

Host

No, it hasn’t been that long. I’ve saved up the processing for this show. You’re welcome.

00:09:10

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. Good. [Laughs.] 

[Biz laughs.] 

As usual. As per usual. [Laughs.] So… I don’t know—I don’t know how to do this in a way that I won’t later be like, “Aah! Why did I say these things and why did I end on this note?” But I don’t know how to end on any note, because it feels weird to end. But it just is what it is, and it is going to be okay. 

00:09:38

Biz 

Host

It is gonna be okay. I mean, I don’t like it. Let’s—I’m just gonna start with that. I don’t like it. But… but! Throughout this entire process—since we started this podcast—I think we have both been very honest that… this is a podcast. Our lives and our friendship hold much greater precedence. And… when this becomes something that no longer fits—for whatever the reason—that it’s okay. And… I mean, just to make it be incredibly One Bad Mother in its style, I think it’s a thing that so many people have to deal with. There are so many things once kids come into our lives in which we say, “When this, if that, or I can make it all work.” And then… when it’s not working anymore—whether it’s—I mean, like, it’s so easy for us to be like, “It’s not working ‘cause I can’t because I’m a failure and I can’t do all—” Okay, maybe just me. Theresa’s like, “No.”

[Theresa laughs.] 

“That’s not it.” But we all make those decisions!

00:10:52

Theresa 

Host

I totally do that. Yeah! Of course! Yes.

00:10:54

Biz 

Host

And they’re hard! And they’re not fun. And we never know if they’re the right ones. And I know that it has… been much easier to carry the show these last, y’know, year and a half or so, with the gentle lying hug that is “it’s just a placeholder.” Right? And that you’re gonna come back.

00:11:17

Theresa 

Host

Theresa’s coming back. Yeah.

00:11:20

Biz 

Host

Theresa’s coming back. And… it definitely… I’m—I’ll just go back to what I said to begin with. I don’t like it! It definitely is one of those, like, “Well then what am I supposed to do?!” 

[Theresa laughs.] 

Right? ‘Cause it’s all about me, everybody.

00:11:37

Theresa 

Host

It is—yeah, it is! This show’s about you!

00:11:40

Biz 

Host

Yeah! I know!

[Theresa laughs.] 

But here’s the thing. Here’s the thing. I—this is basically… basically, I want to spend time with us laughing and remembering some of our favorite moments. So I’m just gonna say this—well obviously, guys, this is a weirdo special show. Okay. So… just roll with us. If you’re listening for the first time, Theresa and I have kids.

[Theresa laughs.] 

We’re parents. We’re juggling a lot. I don’t know. Like—[Laughs.] 

00:12:07

Theresa 

Host

If you’re listening for the first time, just pick a different episode.

00:12:10

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: Any! Other! Episode! Yeah. Yeah. Really. 

Theresa: This is gonna be so confusing. Truly any other. Any other.

00:12:16

Biz 

Host

You guys—the OBM listeners have essentially witnessed Theresa and I becoming friends. Over the last… I cannot believe this—ten years!

00:12:28

Theresa 

Host

Yeah! What?

00:12:30

Biz 

Host

And I have no idea what sort of parent or really what sort of Self I’d be? If you had not been my friend. 

00:12:40

Theresa 

Host

[Sentimentally] Oh. 

00:12:43

Biz 

Host

And I… it’s weird that we’ve done this publicly? [Laughs.] 

00:12:47

Theresa 

Host

Mm-hm. [Laughs.] It really is.

00:12:50

Biz 

Host

You’re welcome, everybody. But the lesson that I have taken away from having you not only as my friend, but as a partner in this show, is… just the acceptance of who I am. Like, of allowing myself to be… myself. Allowing myself to be—like… laughing at my failures. And laughing at how hard this is. Just being okay hating it sometimes. And even more importantly—being okay liking it! Because I think it’s easier for me to joke about hating something? Than it is to be honest about liking it. And that is something that I would not consider if I had not spent this time with you. 

00:13:50

Theresa 

Host

I wanna just add that… our friendship is everything to me about this show? And like… the community? And the community that I think we learned so much from. I think back to when Grace was questioning her gender identity early on. Going back to our message boards and emails we’ve gotten from people and just sort of connecting with our community more? Was my initial connection to learning. What might be going on. Y’know. For my kid. And that was—I don’t even have—there’s no value you can place on that. It was everything. It was a connection to… to, like, something that I don’t know how long it would’ve taken me to get there without our community? And then you being there as my friend… to process that with me, off and on the air… was… I mean, it will just always be like a part of our family. Not just a part of my experience doing this show. I mean, that is—it was a formative time for our family and a formative place for me to grow and learn. And I think adjacent to that or related to that is just… how much fun it was to come and talk every week? Like, I—I mean, like, we joke about like how things are hard and dreary all the time, and we don’t get to have as much fun as we would like to have? But like, truly coming to work on Mondays to do this show with you in the booth—in “the period hut”—

00:15:45

Biz 

Host

In the period hut. I still have the banner right on my wall right over there. [Laughs.] 

00:15:49

Theresa 

Host

Yeah! Yes! I mean, that was such a highlight of my life for years. Like, it just always—even when there were hard things to talk about? And sometimes I was nervous to come in, too? But I always wanted to come in. Like, always. And it was always so fun. And I remember hearing from… some of you all in the community at times like, “Oh, I’m so jealous of Biz and Theresa and their friendship! I wish I had a mom friend that I could talk to about blah, blah, blah, blah, blah!” And I remember thinking—like, hearing those and being like, “Yeah! I’d be jealous of us, too!”

[Biz laughs.] 

We have something really—we do! We have something really special! And that’s—I mean, I think that that is… why I have dragged this out for so long! Because I… I don’t wanna lose everything that this has been. And obviously I won’t lose you as a friend, um. But I think… I think what I want you all in the community to know? Is how important and everlasting One Bad Mother is for me in my heart. In my family. And just who I am as a person and as a parent. Like, always. It’s never going to go anywhere. It’s like the foundation. It’s the foundation. Y’know? 

00:17:15

Biz 

Host

No. I know. I… I’m 100% with you, especially when it comes to the honesty and support the community has shown us. And… y’know, I will always be grateful for being called out when things I’ve done or said were problematic and people giving me the grace and patience to talk with me and allowing me to listen. And I… I—[sighs]. It was easier to have you wait. To do this. Because… the idea of mayyybe you coming back and maybe us going back to the conversations we had, has allowed me to tootle along as I have. And y’know, I… I’ve certainly had people ask, “Well what if you brought in another host?” And I’m like, “I don’t even wanna share the genius and fail calls with anybody other than Theresa.” Because… of your kindness and your empathy and, again, that other unique voice in the room. We care so much about the community that having somebody come in and think these calls are a joke versus being funny because we’re all there with you… is terrifying to me.

00:18:44

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. We can’t have that. 

00:18:45

Biz 

Host

Uh-uh. And what—

00:18:46

Theresa 

Host

Gabe won’t let it happen. [Laughs.] 

00:18:47

Biz 

Host

Gabe won’t let it happen! And what really sucks is I was trying to like—I was listening to old shows, trying to find some fun clips, and I… the show is, I think, powered by our friendship. And I really… I don’t know how that will impact the show going forward. And I—like I said at the beginning—hate it. And I won’t miss you as my friend, because we will forever be friends. But I will miss… talking about and hashing out what it’s like to be Selves with kids in our house. 

00:19:35

Theresa 

Host

Mm-hm.

00:19:36

Biz 

Host

‘Cause this show was never about our kids. 

00:19:37

Theresa 

Host

No. 

00:19:39

Biz 

Host

And… and I’ll miss you very, very much. And I love you very, very much. And I appreciate you taking the risk to do this show with me ten years ago. And for becoming my friend. I love you.

00:19:59

Theresa 

Host

I love you, too. It’s been amazing.

00:20:01

Biz 

Host

It’s been—

00:20:03

Theresa 

Host

I’m gonna miss you so much. [Laughs.] 

00:20:04

Biz 

Host

Alright. So guys… I’m about to say something to Theresa. It’s my favorite thing to say. And that I hope you guys will stick around to sort of enjoy just—I mean—a taste of the amazing things that have come out of this show because of Theresa. So with that said—Theresa? You are doing… such a good job. And I see you. 

00:20:38

Theresa 

Host

Thanks, Biz. So are you. And I see you, too. 

00:20:42

Biz 

Host

And I love you.

00:20:44

Theresa 

Host

And I love you.

00:20:45

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz and Theresa: Byeee!

00:20:48

Biz 

Host

This is Biz. I’m a stay-at-home mom with a preschooler.

00:20:51

Theresa 

Host

And I’m Theresa, a working mom with a toddler.

00:20:54

Biz 

Host

This is a show about life after giving life. We all need a place to vent, so don’t listen with your kids because there will be swears. This… is One Bad Mother.

00:21:03

Music

Music

“Summon the Rawk” by Kevin MacLeod. Driving electric guitar and heavy drums.

[Continues through dialogue.]

00:21:10

Theresa 

Host

Yeah!

[Biz laughs.] 

00:21:11

Biz 

Host

Hi, Theresa!

00:21:12

Theresa 

Host

Hi, Biz!

00:21:13

Biz 

Host

Welcome to our very first show!

00:21:16

Theresa 

Host

I can’t believe it!

00:21:17

Biz 

Host

Of One Bad Mother.

00:21:18

Theresa 

Host

It’s happening!

00:21:19

Biz 

Host

It’s—it is exciting!

00:21:20

Theresa 

Host

[Singing] Hooray! Hooray! Hooray, hooray, hooray! It’s weaning day! It’s weaning day! It’s weaning day!

[Both laugh.]

00:21:29

Biz 

Host

Becoming a mom… the best way I can describe it—it’s like being dropped in the middle of the forest. With nothing. And people have told you what a forest is. But this forest is not that forest. And so for the first year, two years, you’re trying to figure out how to get out of this forest, and even now—at like three years—I am nowhere near finding an exit to the forest, but I can maybe make myself a shelter and find food—

[Theresa laughs.] 

—for my child and I to eat. But again—nowhere close to the exit of the forest. Like I just feel completely lost. How did you—how did you deal with that? ‘Cause you’re still—I’m a three years. Three-and-a-half years. 

00:22:10

Theresa 

Host

Mm-hm. I totally get the forest thing that you’re talking about? And I was definitely in a forest, too? But my forest was like… a [through laughter] beautiful—

[Biz laughs.] 

A beautiful fantasy, like… magic land or something? Which like… [Laughs.] 

00:22:28

Biz 

Host

If only my brain worked that way.

[Theresa laughs.] 

Everything’s like a problem I have to solve for some insane reason and I could just—so—okay. Continue. Continue. Continue making me jealous. 

00:22:40

Theresa 

Host

Well, it was! I mean… well no! That’s the thing. Like, it wasn’t—I mean, it’s not all good. I didn’t want really anything to do with the rest of my life. Y’know. And so I was so in love with my baby and yeah. I was really tired and there were things going on that were sometimes difficult, but like everything about my baby and being a mom? Was the most heavenly thing that I had ever experienced. 

00:23:06

Biz 

Host

How are you, Theresa? 

00:23:09

Theresa 

Host

Dude.

[Biz laughs.] 

I—seriously? I have seriously I have a story for you. Okay?

00:23:14

Biz 

Host

I am going to settle in.

00:23:16

Theresa 

Host

Alright. So Jesse’s on a sixteen-day-long tour.

00:23:20

Biz 

Host

Right.

00:23:21

Theresa 

Host

It’s been going fine. Okay? But—

00:23:24

Biz 

Host

You’re here.

00:23:26

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. I’m here. I’m alive. My kids are alive.

[Biz laughs.] 

Um… so the other day… I… like, I sold our couch on Craigslist, ‘cause we wanna get a different couch?

00:23:38

Biz 

Host

Is this the—is this the couch that the yogurt went into? No. Different couch. [Laughs.] 

00:23:42

Theresa 

Host

No. Different couch. That couch is just gonna stay and continue to get more and more destroyed as time goes on.

00:23:48

Biz 

Host

Smart. Smart.

00:23:50

Theresa 

Host

So this is our regular living room couch. And I sold it to this very nice couple on Craigslist. They came to pick it up. I had to move Jesse’s car from outside our front gate to make room for the people to carry the couch out. Okay? So then later, the couch is gone. The kids are a little wired because the couch is gone! That’s like just weird, y’know? It’s like kind of exciting and fun.

00:24:13

Biz 

Host

“The couch is here? Is the couch not here?” Right.

00:24:14

Theresa 

Host

Like—y’know. And so I had to go back out and get Jesse’s car and move it back. Y’know. And I’m like—it crossed my mind, like… “I can leave for two minutes.”

00:24:27

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: Two minutes. Just to move the—

Theresa: That’s—it’s gonna take me two seconds. Right? 

00:24:30

Theresa 

Host

I mean, really two minutes. Like actually, technically, about two minutes. That’s not an exaggeration. That’s not—

00:24:35

Biz 

Host

No. Get in the car. Drive it in. Get out of the car.

00:24:39

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. Back in. Like, that’s basically it. So I’m like, “Guys, I’m just moving Daddy’s car. I’ll be right back.” And they’re like, “Okayyy!” And they’re running around. I don’t even know if they noticed—like, sometimes I try to not make a big deal of disappearing for a second? ‘Cause they’re in the middle of playing. Like—

00:24:53

Biz 

Host

They wouldn’t even know. Right.

00:24:55

Theresa 

Host

And so… but as I come back inside, I hear water running. And I’m like, “Did they—” And they’re screaming and laughing in the house.

[Biz laughs.] 

And I’m like, “Did they just get in the shower? Did they turn on the shower and get in the shower? What are they doing?” 

00:25:09

Biz 

Host

Sillies. 

00:25:12

Theresa 

Host

As I walk up to the house, I notice…

00:25:14

Biz 

Host

No.

00:25:16

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. Okay. They have—no, you can’t even guess. There’s no way we’d even guess what they did in the two minutes that I was gone. They turned on the garden hose and they shoved it through the mail slot into the kitchen.

00:25:26

Biz 

Host

Oh my god!

00:25:28

Theresa 

Host

They turned it on full blast! Like, full-blast garden hose through the mail slot and they propped it there. Then they were inside. Simon had put on his swim trunks. 

00:25:37

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: Oh. My. [Laughs.] My god. 

Theresa: And they were screaming and laughing hysterically!

00:25:42

Theresa 

Host

And bouncing off the walls and playing in the water! In the kitchen!

00:25:45

Biz 

Host

That’s filling up your kitchen!

00:25:47

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: That’s filling up my kitchen! Yes.

Biz: It’s literally filling up your kitchen.

00:25:50

Theresa 

Host

Hardwood floor kitchen.

00:25:52

Biz 

Host

Oh… my… god, Theresa!

00:25:57

Theresa 

Host

Yes! Yes! That is the correct response!

Um, so I was out having a nice little coffee and pastry with my mom, who was visiting. And my lovely little Simon. Had Simon on my lap. I was kinda sharing my little croissant with him. Just little bits of it. And I had decided to have an iced vanilla latte. I took a few weeks off coffee ‘cause it was making me nauseous, but now I’m kinda back on?

00:26:22

Biz 

Host

Thank god.

00:26:24

Theresa 

Host

And it’s wonderful. But—it’s—this is kind of a double fail, because I probably shouldn’t have even been really having the latte ‘cause I’m pregnant and I had already had really strong black tea that morning?

[Biz laughs.] 

So I’m sitting there having the iced latte, and then I real—and I’m talking to my mom. We’re totally deep into our conversation. And I look down and I realize I’ve been giving Simon—

[Biz laughs.] 

—the iced latte with the straw. And he’s just been drinking it for like—I don’t even know how long?

[Biz laughs.] 

Like, I really have no idea how long. And—‘cause the way I thought of it is like, “I’m trying to get it away from him.” And I start to—he doesn’t wanna give it up! He’s like way into it. ‘Cause y’know, it’s a vanilla latte. It’s like really sweet and really good! Yeah!

00:27:02

Biz 

Host

And delicious and full of caffeine. 

00:27:05

Theresa 

Host

Totally! And he’s just sucking it down. And I’m like—he really likes this! What—and then I was like, “Oh, fuck! I’m not supposed to give this to you!”

[Biz laughs.] 

So anyway. That was… that was wonderful.

00:27:14

Biz 

Host

That is horrible. That’s horrible. [Laughs.] 

00:27:16

Theresa 

Host

Thanks.

00:27:18

Biz 

Host

And then just try saying “unsolicited mom advice.” 

00:27:19

Theresa 

Host

[In excessively peppy tone] “Unsolicited mom advice!”

[Biz laughs.] 

00:27:24

Biz 

Host

Oh, that’s so good! Do that again. Alright. So then—you’re super intense. 

00:27:28

Theresa 

Host

Okay.

00:27:29

Biz 

Host

Okay.

00:27:30

Theresa 

Host

Alright

[Biz laughs.] 

Before we begin.

00:27:31

Biz 

Host

Remember—

00:27:33

Theresa 

Host

This show is for you, moms.

00:27:35

Biz 

Host

Not for babies! 

00:27:36

Theresa 

Host

Listen wherever and however you want, but don’t expose your children to our profanity.

00:27:41

Biz 

Host

They don’t fucking deserve that.

[Theresa sighs.]

00:27:44

Theresa 

Host

I don’t feel like I wanna be in public anymore? Like, and like it’s not that I don’t feel like I—it’s not that I’m like, “Oh, I look so terrible I don’t want people to see me” or something? It’s like… I don’t feel like I’m part of the world anymore? Like I know—do you know what I’m saying?

[Biz laughs.] 

00:27:59

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: Yeah! That yeah, you’re “other” now. You’re “other.”

Theresa: Like, I can’t—yeah! Yeah! 

00:28:02

Theresa 

Host

And I feel like I’m gonna be “other” for a while. ‘Cause I know that once the baby comes I’ll be “other.” Y’know.

00:28:06

Biz 

Host

Well it’s like y’know when you like walk past… [Laughs.] The first thing that comes to mind is a garbage can fire. But what I meant to say was like a piece of machinery that’s working kinda loud and people like—

[Theresa laughs.] 

—people go around it? They’re like, “I know it’s doing its job, but it sounds dangerous a little bit.” And so you like—people just kinda start crossing the street around that piece of equipment? And—or a garbage can fire. Whichever. 

[Theresa laughs.] 

And so—yes! You are “other” for—we all know you’re doing your job and you’re like making this thing. Especially—

00:28:37

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: And it’s like—right? It’s fine. Yeah. Yeah! Yeah! We don’t wanna see it! Right! Yeah! [Laughs.] 

Biz: But like, it’s almost too magical for us to be around? Like, don’t look directly at the unicorn. Yeah. 

00:28:44

Biz 

Host

Pull the curtain back, Oz! I don’t wanna be fucking any part of this thing that is completely necessary for our life to continue.

[Theresa laughs.] 

You’re making me uncomfortable. I’m just gonna look at my phone.

00:28:57

Theresa 

Host

Oh, it’s so funny!

00:29:00

Biz 

Host

Underwear. [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:29:03

Theresa 

Host

Undiesss! You don’t like undies? 

00:29:07

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: That’s like the cutest word ever!

Biz: I don’t like anything that goes against my skin. [Laughs.] [Sighs.]

00:29:11

Theresa 

Host

So… I… found in my car an invitation to a birthday party for one of Curtis’s friends from preschool. [Pause.] And it was last weekend. Like, I never saw it come into my car. I don’t know how it got in my car? Maybe somebody used my car to—maybe Jesse used my car to pick Curtis up one day and left it in the car, or maybe the teachers just handed it to me with some other stuff and I was like, “I’ll look at this later.” And… so I never RSVP’d. I never—nothing! Just nothing. And we missed the birthday party. 

00:29:54

Biz 

Host

Wow.

00:29:55

Theresa 

Host

Yeah! 

00:29:56

Biz 

Host

The universe fucking hates you.

00:29:58

Theresa 

Host

I know!

[Biz laughs.] 

00:30:01

Biz 

Host

And then can you say “fail” a couple of times in a variety of ways?

[Theresa laughs.]

00:30:08

Theresa 

Host

[Dramatically.] Fail. [Angrily] Fail! Fail! 

00:30:12

Biz 

Host

See? That—“Fail!” It comes out right away.

00:30:15

Theresa 

Host

[Assertively] Fail! Fail! [Meanly] Fail! [Growly] Fail! [Loudly] Fail! 

00:30:22

Biz 

Host

Alright. Those are good.

00:30:23

Theresa 

Host

Okay. But I think also, it is… healthy for us to remember that like… in avoiding having things fall apart? It’s important to remember that sometimes when things fall apart, we can remember that that’s not something we did wrong? Like… things might fall apart and that might be okay, or just part of life. Like… I have gotten better at letting things fall apart [through laughter] when I plan for them to fall apart. And that’s—that’s a step!

[Monotone] A little louder. A little louder. Biz, will you talk? Please?

00:31:02

Biz 

Host

[Laughs.] You don’t have to ask me twice!

00:31:03

Theresa 

Host

So Biz sounds good.

00:31:04

Biz 

Host

[Singing] Theresaaa! [Regular voice] How are you?

00:31:08

Theresa 

Host

I am pretty good. I—I wanna remind everyone that the Thorns—the Thorn family—have a family motto. And our motto is—in case you’ve all forgotten—“Thorns love a challenge.”

00:31:20

Biz 

Host

They do.

[Theresa laughs.] 

We talk about the Thorns loving a challenge in our family.

00:31:25

Theresa 

Host

You do? [Laughs.] 

00:31:26

Biz 

Host

All the time.

00:31:27

Theresa 

Host

Okay. [Laughs.] 

00:31:28

Biz 

Host

It’s very motivating to us. So alright. Thorns love a challenge.

00:31:32

Theresa 

Host

So I… I mean, I’m always, I guess, challenging myself in new ways? [Laughs.] 

[Biz laughs.] 

I have three kids, guys. Um—

00:31:43

Biz 

Host

Yeah! Challenge!

00:31:44

Theresa 

Host

I’m challenged. I’m just gonna go.

00:31:47

Biz 

Host

Go.

00:31:48

Theresa 

Host

Um, well, last night—[clears throat]. I should say, this morning, right before I woke up, I was having a dream. That I was eating pie. 

00:31:58

Biz 

Host

Oh! That’s a nice dream.

00:31:59

Theresa 

Host

And it was delicious. 

00:32:01

Biz 

Host

That’s it? 

00:32:02

Theresa 

Host

Yep!

[Biz laughs.] 

00:32:04

Biz 

Host

Did you—[Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

I was having a sip of something to drink. I think I totally missed that. Wait. Your—[Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.]

Your genius—

00:32:13

Theresa 

Host

I totally think that qualifies! 

00:32:14

Biz 

Host

That you had a dream—

00:32:16

Theresa 

Host

I had an amazing dream right before waking up this morning that I was eating this like berry pie. And it was really great. 

[Long pause.]

00:32:22

Biz 

Host

Are you gonna go seek that pie out—

00:32:23

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz: —and fulfill your destiny?
 
Theresa: I’ll probably have pie at some point. Yeah.

00:32:26

Theresa 

Host

But the dream was what makes me a genius. [Laughs.] 

[Biz laughs.] 

00:32:31

Biz 

Host

Theresa.

00:32:32

Theresa 

Host

Yes.

00:32:33

Biz 

Host

Do you craft? 

00:32:34

Theresa 

Host

No. 

[Biz laughs.] 

00:32:36

Biz 

Host

But you’re a mom! I’m pretty sure…

00:32:39

Theresa 

Host

I think I’m a mom. I’m a mom in most ways.

[Biz laughs.] 

00:32:42

Biz 

Host

“Think I’m a mom.” You—you created a life. You crafted a life!

00:32:48

Theresa 

Host

I gave birth to two kids, but I don’t craft. So am I a mom?

00:32:52

Biz 

Host

The ultimate craft. The ultimate crafter. You made two people. The ultimate—do you go back and check your work for perfection? [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

Alright. I think we should—Theresa actually brought this up as a topic, which I found really interesting.

00:33:07

Theresa 

Host

Oh, that is such a lie!

00:33:08

Biz 

Host

That is not a lie!

00:33:09

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: I’m just kidding. [Laughs.] 

Biz: Anyway. So—

00:33:10

Biz 

Host

I thought this was really—‘cause my first response was, “You wanna talk about crafting?” I was like, “What’s there to say about crafting? I fucking love crafting and I’m pretty sure you don’t.” But like how deep does this go? And then as we kinda thought about it I was like, “I think this is gonna touch on… yet another thing that we either feel great about or feel like shit about or somehow turns into a, ‘Oh. She does crafting.’ Just another way to be assholes to each other.” 

00:33:38

Theresa 

Host

I mean, it was the full whatever. Sack of bananas.

00:33:42

Biz 

Host

The circus has come to—

00:33:44

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: The full sack of bananas.

Biz: —the full sack of bananas! [Laughs.] 

00:33:46

Theresa 

Host

The Costco-sized sack.

00:33:49

Biz 

Host

Bulk bananas! [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:33:53

Theresa 

Host

And so I’m still—that was two nights ago. I’m still recovering from that today. 

00:33:58

Biz 

Host

You should have known that was coming, because you did something nice for yourself.

00:34:03

Theresa 

Host

I should have, yes.

00:34:06

Biz 

Host

The scales needed to be balanced.

00:34:09

Theresa 

Host

Something is going on.

[Biz laughs.] 

00:34:11

Biz 

Host

And it ain’t in your belly!

00:34:13

Theresa 

Host

Yeah! Yeah. Um, outside of growing another child, there’s—there’s been a lot of stuff going on in the Thorn household. So the thing I wanted to talk about today is that my oldest child—my five-year-old—who everybody, including myself, has known as “Simon” for the first at least five years of his life—is—has been self-identifying as a girl for a little over two months. And so in our house and at her school—we’re using female pronouns—and she’s not going by “Simon” anymore. She’s going by the name “Grace.” Which she chose. And… I… [sighs]. I’ve struggled with how to talk about this on the show. Primarily out of just like… respect for her privacy and what she’s going through? And also just because when you make an announcement like this? It feels very final? 

00:35:11

Biz 

Host

Yeah. Like you’re locked in.

00:35:13

Theresa 

Host

Yeah. 

[Biz laughs.] 

And that was how I felt about supporting her with the transition at school? Like, I felt like I wanted to—the desire was to say, “Well are you absolutely sure?! Because once you do this—” Like, whatever. Which—for a variety of reasons, and after a lot of research, y’know, I learned—is just not the way to handle it with a kid.

[Biz laughs.] 

It just doesn’t make any sense. Like—

00:35:37

Biz 

Host

That’s kind of true for almost everything with kids!

00:35:41

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: It’s almost anything with kids. Yeah.

Biz: Almost anything! So—

00:35:44

Biz 

Host

There’s some comfort there in knowing that that is the right, but—like, at the same time… in all cases of having to implement that—that approach? There’s still a question of, “How am I supposed to be doing this?” Y’know? So like—“Should I be locking this in? Should I not be locking this in? Should I support so much that we’re fully committed?” So—

00:36:03

Theresa 

Host

Well, yeah! I mean, there wasn’t… I mean, at a certain point what you realize is… it doesn’t matter? If it’s final? It’s just what’s happening right now. And like… there’s no reason to—if you make it—if you make your support contingent on finality or like—the child being certain—100% sure—then you’re not really being supportive of the child? It’s like… it’s impossible to do that. Like, it’s not—not only is a five-year-old unable to actually give that kind of assurance, but like it doesn’t benefit anybody to be sure. So what I ended up saying to her teacher—which is what I’m gonna say to you guys—is that, y’know, Jesse and I don’t know what’s gonna be in her future! We don’t know what is to come. We don’t know where this is headed. And y’know, this—this may be something that goes on for a few more months. It may be something that goes on for a few more years. It may be something that is forever. We don’t know. But for now, I mean—and for now and for always, we’re just supporting her in it. 

Oh, my opening is gonna be sunscreen related. [Laughs.] 

00:37:16

Biz 

Host

Good. Mine’s Band-Aid related. Summerrr! Um—[Laughs.] Okay. You ready? Alright. Wonderful. Oh, what are you so—and Theresa—

00:37:29

Theresa 

Host

Sunscreen.

00:37:31

Biz 

Host

And Theresa equals sunscreen. Is that—[Laughs.] 

00:37:34

Theresa 

Host

Theresa, um…

00:37:36

Biz 

Host

Lays it on thick!

00:37:38

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: Yeah, there ya go. Perfect. There ya go. [Laughs.] 

Biz: With sunscreen. 

00:37:40

Biz 

Host

Do you want me to be “Lays it on thick with sunscreen” or just “Lays it on thick”? 

00:37:44

Theresa 

Host

I like—ohhh, I liked the way you did it with a pause. Like, “She lays it on thick—"

00:37:48

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Both: With sunscreen.

00:37:50

Biz 

Host

Mrow, mrow, mrow, mrowww. Okay. Alright. 

Parenting… is the toughest job. But also the most rewarding. 

[Theresa laughs.] 

Says the internet. What do you think that means? What do you—when I say to you, “Theresa, I know it’s really hard. Three kids. No sleep. The whole thing. Just turning one. It’s hard, but it’s rewarding.” What does that—she’s looking at me like she wants to punch me out of the chair.

[Theresa laughs.] 

What… what do you think about rewards? 

00:38:23

Theresa 

Host

It is not, I think—it does not fit my thinking. About—like, it’s a framework for thinking about life? And stuff? 

00:38:34

Biz 

Host

Oh, that’s good! [Laughs.] 

00:38:35

Theresa 

Host

That does not actually fit me. It might fit other people. I remember—

00:38:41

Biz 

Host

So glad Theresa does this show with me. [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:38:45

Theresa 

Host

Like, I remember somebody saying to me at some point, like, when I started having kids, like, something like, “Well, yep, you just do the best you can and then when they’re eighteen you find out if you did a good job.” 

[Biz laughs.] 

Which like—and they were like dead serious! And I was like, “Huh.” Like, what—that kind of thinking blew my fucking mind. ‘Cause I was like—not that it was wrong, but just that I was like, “Wow!” Like, really?! Is that what you did? You were just like… “Fingers crossed!” Doing all this stuff and then the first time you’re gonna check in is when they’re eighteen and you find out yes or not? Like, all or nothing? Like…

[Biz laughs.] 

It just seems so funny. But it’s similar with this rewarding thing in that it presumes that we are doing something to get something else. 

00:39:34

Biz 

Host

Oh!

00:39:35

Theresa 

Host

It presumes that there is work—work towards an enjoyable product. Like, from that work. Like, directly—like, there is a direct reward product that comes out of our sweat and toil. 

00:39:49

Biz 

Host

Right!

00:39:51

Theresa 

Host

Which… in my experience, just—almost never happens that way. Like, for me, it’s much more everything is happening all at once time? At all times. Like, I’m much more like process-oriented in my daily life? And I think a lot of us are. Because you can only stop and—

00:40:13

Biz 

Host

[Laughs.] It’s like, every night it’s like, everybody goes to bed and you like sit down and you’re like, “I’m ready… for my reward!”

00:40:18

Theresa 

Host

Bring me my cupcake! Yeah!

00:40:19

Biz 

Host

“What is my reward?” Right? Like, “Here it comes!” 

00:40:22

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Biz and Theresa: Woooo!

00:40:24

Biz 

Host

[Singing] Let’s talk about sex, baby!

00:40:26

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Both: [Singing] Let’s talk about you and me! Let’s talk about all the good things and the bad things that may be! 

00:40:32

Biz 

Host

Let’s talk about sex! Let’s talk about sex! I love it! Hot to trot! Make any man’s eyes pop! ‘K.

[Both laugh.]

00:40:42

Biz 

Host

Theresa? How are you? [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:40:45

Theresa 

Host

I… I’m tired! I—like I said, I’m just—I’m a little spent. I was reflecting over the weekend on—I don’t know if you remember this, Biz. Maybe some of you guys remember. I had a moment at—when Oscar was a baby and Grace was, I guess, she was two years and three months when Oscar was born. So sometime around when Grace was two-and-a-half-ish and Oscar was a baby, I remember having this moment that I talked about on the show where somebody asked me at the preschool—said, like, “I’m gonna have two soon. Like, a similar age difference. How is it?” And I said, “It’s great.” 

00:41:29

Biz 

Host

What?! [Laughs.] 

00:41:30

Theresa 

Host

And then I came on the show and I said, “I don’t know why I said that!”

00:41:34

Biz 

Host

Yeah. I remember this.

00:41:37

Theresa 

Host

“It is not great!”

[Both laugh.]

And then we kinda like took that apart and talked about it. And I’ve been having this experience recently where I’ve been running into, y’know, parent friends at the elementary school and at the preschool and everybody knew that Baby Curtis was coming and everybody knew I already had two kids and—y’know, it’s—I feel like it’s pretty—where we live, it’s pretty common for people to have two kids. I feel like most people I know have two kids or are planning to have two. There are definitely plenty of people with one. And then you don’t see the three as much in L.A. I think it’s more common through the United States, but I think in L.A.—whatever. Cost of living, just culturally, people just don’t have—you don’t see it as much. And so people definitely look at me with the big eyes, y’know? And they wanna know how it’s going!

00:42:28

Biz 

Host

“Are you visiting, honey?” [Laughs.] 

00:42:30

Theresa 

Host

Yeah! 

00:42:31

Biz 

Host

“You visiting?” [Laughs.] 

00:42:32

Theresa 

Host

And they wanna know how it’s going! And/or they’re just being polite and making conversation. And… I just… I’ve been really struggling with this! Because I don’t… like, on the one hand? Like, I—I’m so—like, I just—I am so happy, genuinely. I just love—I love that I have three kids now! I really wanted Curtis! You guys know that. Like, I’m really, really happy. And—but like—

[Biz laughs.] 

It’s not like most people’s idea of a good time. Do you know what I mean? 

[Biz laughs.] 
 
So when somebody asks me, like, “How’s it going?” I just have… I have no good response to that. Like I wanna kind of just be like, “Well, how do you think? You guys know.” These are other parents I’m talking about. Like, this is—you guys know how it is, probably! Pretty much. If you have a kid. It’s just… three of them. And so I’m doing that. That’s what I’m up to. [Laughs.] 

00:43:26

Biz 

Host

Let’s talk about… maybe… cake parenting and how we can apply it now! Why we should apply it now. Just gonna throw some questions out, and let’s just explore them. ‘K? So… what are the rules and guidelines of cake parenting? 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:43:45

Theresa 

Host

I’m sorry. Can we—

[Biz laughs.] 

Can we—can we be critical first? And then—or are we gonna purely accept this as being helpful and correct?

[Biz laughs.] 

And go forward—

00:44:00

Biz 

Host

What? What do you mean, Theresa? I am clinging to the concept! Alright. Cake parenting, then, Theresa. Do you think…

[Theresa laughs.] 

It’s a good idea? Or a bad idea?

00:44:14

Theresa 

Host

I mean—

[Biz laughs.] 

So… yeah. I mean, it’s—well it’s hilarious. Right? Because it’s really unhealthy? I mean, like… right? Can we—

00:44:26

Biz 

Host

But is it?

00:44:28

Theresa 

Host

Well, okay. So here’s the thing.

[Biz laughs.] 

Like, the idea of solving problems with food? Is not a new one. And not special. Because like you can go back to like chicken soup and hot beverages—warm beverages that are very soothing and comforting and y’know, a warm, cooked meal can be very—y’know. And there’s like lots of things that are like that. But like, cake in particular…

[Biz laughs.] 

Is there a nutritional value at all in cake?

00:44:58

Biz 

Host

Carrot cake? 

[Theresa laughs.] 

It’s got the word “carrot” in it!

00:45:01

Theresa 

Host

It’s got the word “carrot” in it.

00:45:04

Biz 

Host

Okay. Before we even get into that, Theresa—how are you? And if you wouldn’t mind, I feel like for the listeners, we need to—

[Theresa laughs.] 

—update who our children are. I think it’s important in particular for our sleep episode! 

00:45:17

Crosstalk

Crosstalk

Theresa: Yeah. True. So like a “who lives in your house,” then?

Biz: Right. Yeah. Yeah, “who lives in your house” and “how are you?”

00:45:20

Theresa 

Host

Okay. Great. So I live with my husband, Jesse, and we have three children. Grace, who’s six-and-a-half, Oscar, who’s four, and Curtis, who just turned one. And our two very annoying but very sweet dogs. 

[Biz laughs.] 

[Through laughter] What the fuck was I talking about? Can I just go to sleep? I feel like I started to drift off as I was naming people who live in my house.

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:45:45

Biz  

Host

When you were doing that, I grew tired actually. I was like this—I could just—can we just get some sleep? Is this gonna be about our kids’ sleep issues or our sleep issues? 

00:45:55

Theresa   

Host

Or ours. Okay. So head in the game. Alright?

00:45:58

Biz 

Host

Wake up! [Claps.]

00:45:59

Theresa 

Host

Okay. I’m here. I’m present. I’ve had a cappuccino. My house is very full, and there are a lot of young children who need help with a lot of things.

[Biz laughs.] 

And recently—like, especially on the weekends—but also the evenings. It’s just—it’s—it’s almost like—you guys probably know this feeling. It’s an out-of-body experience sometimes? Where I am so busy taking care of the needs of others for like a chunk of time. I’m not talking like from the moment I wake up in the morning ‘til when I go to sleep. But there are some very busy, particular chunks of the week where I’m just—it’s one thing after another with each of the three kids and/or the dogs or whatever. And I—it really is an out-of-body experience, and I recently [through laughter] had this moment—

[Biz laughs.] 

—where I was in one of these moments at home and then I stopped and I sat down to nurse my baby right before I was gonna put him to bed. And [through laughter] I did this thing, which was—I said to myself—

[Biz laughs.] 

In my head, I said, “Hello, Self.” [Laughs.] 

[Biz laughs.] 

And then I said, “I am a Self.”

[Biz laughs.] 

And it was—it was so amazing because it was so absurd, and so sad? But also it helped me? Because I was like—I fully came back into my body and went, “Oh! Here I am!” 

[Biz laughs.] 

“I am me! I am someone! I—[Laughs.] “

00:47:29

Biz 

Host

“Theresa Thorn, the ‘I Am Me’ story.”

00:47:33

Theresa 

Host

I’m not just like some disembodied arms that are going around helping people with things. And so—I know, it’s the best! And so now—this has become this weird mantra for me? Over the last few weeks? Where I will stop and I will—and I will go, “Hello, Self. I am a Self.” [Laughs.] 

[Biz laughs.] 

I’m laughing so hard that it hurts. And… yeah, it’s been great.

00:48:00

Biz 

Host

Oh! [Laughs.] 

[Theresa laughs.] 

00:48:04

Biz 

Host

What did we learn today? I think we learned that… change is inevitable. [Laughs.] And that we have to honor and respect the choices that we feel we need to make for ourselves, even if they seem really scary. And we need to respect the choices of others. And assume they’ve put the thought and care into that choice and to give them the space and respect and love to make it. And… I really am glad that she has been my friend and part of this community? And I am so thankful that you are part of our community. And… it was a weird show. And that’s okay. But the bottom line is… you are also doing a great job? And I see you. And I will talk to you next week. Byeee!

00:49:14

Music

Music

“Mama Blues” by Cornbread Ted and the Butterbeans. Strumming acoustic guitar with harmonica and lyrics.

I got the lowdown momma blues

Got the the lowdown momma blues

Gots the lowdown momma blues

The lowdown momma blues. 

Gots the lowdown momma blues

Got the lowdown momma blues

You know that’s right.

[Music fades.]

00:49:38

Biz 

Host

We’d like to thank MaxFun; our producer, Gabe Mara; our husbands, Stefan Lawrence and Jesse Thorn; our perfect children, who provide us with inspiration to say all these horrible things; and of course, you, our listeners. To find out more about the songs you heard on today’s podcast and more about the show, please go to MaximumFun.org/onebadmother. For information about live shows, our book and press, please check out OneBadMotherPodcast.com.

00:50:08

Theresa 

Host

One Bad Mother is a member of the Maximum Fun family of podcasts. To support the show go to MaximumFun.org/join.

[Music resumes for a while before fading out.]

00:50:30

Music

Transition

A cheerful ukulele chord.

00:50:31

Speaker 1

Guest

MaximumFun.org.

00:50:33

Speaker 2

Guest

Comedy and culture.

00:50:34

Speaker 3

Guest

Artist owned—

00:50:35

Speaker 4

Guest

—Audience supported.