Transcript
biz ellis
Hi. I’m Biz.
theresa thorn
And I’m Theresa.
biz
Due to the pandemic, we bring you One Bad Mother straight from our homes—including such interruptions as: children! Animal noises! And more! So let’s all get a little closer while we have to be so far apart. And remember—we are doing a good job.
music
“Summoning the Rawk” by Kevin MacLeod. Driving electric guitar and heavy drums. [Continues through dialogue.]
biz
This week on One Bad Mother—what if pigs could fly? And parenting was easy? We talk with Eric O’Keeffe, host of the podcast What If World. Plus, it’s spring break!
crosstalk
Biz and caller: Wooooo!
caller
So I just tried to lock my keys in the car, but my car didn’t let me! ‘Cause it knew the keys were still inside. So I’m doing great. It’s the first day of Spring. It’s 60 degrees and sunny. So I am just—I’m calling this a win ‘cause I got to get back in my car. [Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] And it’s sunny and I’m gonna go to the playground now with my family. Thank you so much for this show! [Biz laughs.] I really appreciate it. [Laughs.] We’re all doing a great job. Bye!
biz
I really appreciate you! I wanna come to the playground with you and your family! You guys sound like a good time! Isn’t it nice when little miracles happen like that? Beep boop! Like, “Your car! Your keys are still here!” [Laughs.] I… think it is amazing. And I think you are a genius. Your car, my car, all of our cars, may be smarter than us and will one day be our overlords. But at least they won’t let us lock our keys inside of them. So that is good. Well I hope that that spring day was as good as it felt when you called. ‘Cause you’re amazing! You’re doing a great job. You know who else is doing a great job? People! People are doing a great job. In particular, all the people who are giving out vaccines right now. They are sticking people left and right and I think that is amazing. That requires so many hands on deck. Guys, it’s not just the actual people who are injecting you with the vaccines. It’s the people who are keeping track of the data. Making sure people know when and where to get their second doses. The people who are helping you navigate drive-through lines. Sign-ups. The people who call you from CVS or the like when they’ve gone through the list of all the people who had signed up and they had extra doses and then they call if you’re on the list and say, “We have extra doses if you wanna come!” That’s so nice! That’s nice! That’s above and beyond. And just all the volunteers. All the medical personnel. All the pharmacies and the pharmacists. And especially all of you who are going and getting vaccinated. Good job. I just can’t—I can’t tell you… how excited I am! About vaccines! [Laughs.] Yay, science! Also, thank you to all of the medical professionals out there who are continuing to work tirelessly to help those who are infected with COVID-19 as well as who are just sick. And coming into the hospital where, y’know, medical professionals have been running on empty for a year. So… y’know, thank you. And the people who keep those medical facilities clean. All the people who are working in the medical data industry. It ain’t gonna work without you! Thank you to all of the first responders who risk their lives in a variety of ways, including walking into situations in which there is a threat of infection. So thank you.
biz
Thank you to all of the postal service. I love you. You have been delivering—Amazon deliverers, thank you. Thank you, UPS deliverers. Thank you, FedEx deliverers. Thank you everybody who delivers things right now. Thank you to everyone in the retail and grocery industry for staying open. Keeping the shelves stocked. And just being nice. Being nice when you don’t have to be. What a—god, job in which people are probably the worst to you. So I just want you to know that I think you’re doing amazing. And teachers. Thank you, teachers and school administration for working so hard in a crazy network of different rules, different laws, different requirements, depending on where you live. And getting these schools back open and running at whatever capacity that you can, as well as trying to navigate at-home learning still. So I just—god! I see you! You’re all working so hard! [Laughs.] Thank you, thank you, thank you! Guys? I don’t know if you know this—Spring Breaaaak! [Laughs.] Theresa and I have spent several shows talking about spring break, summer break, winter break—all the breaks—are really sort of the wrong use of the word “break” once you have kids in your house. [Laughs.] Because it’s not a break. You have to figure out childcare or work situations or… y’know. I don’t know. Setting up camps or sending ‘em out places to daycare or whatever. Whatever. The deal is, is that they’re in your house for a whole break. And what sucks is they’ve been home for a year already! Like, this is such a bullshit spring break! Spring Breaaaak! Everything’s exactly the same! Whoop, whoop! Except during spring break you get extra TV time and extra Switch videogame time. Yayyyy! So here is to spring break. Just like winter break, but with less presents and hot cocoa. Not as fun. But what if spring break was winter break? No one’s looking. We could just pretend it’s a winter break in April. I think that’s a wonderful idea. Which I think ties in nicely to what we’re gonna talk about today with our guest Eric O’Keeffe, the host of the podcast What If World, and the power of the question, “What if?”
music
Banjo strums; cheerful banjo music continues through dialogue.
theresa
Please—take a moment to remember: If you’re friends of the hosts of One Bad Mother, you should assume that when we talk about other moms, we’re talking about you.
biz
If you are married to the host of One Bad Mother, we definitely are talking about you.
theresa
Nothing we say constitutes professional parenting advice.
biz
Biz and Theresa’s children are brilliant, lovely, and exceedingly extraordinary.
theresa
Nothing said on this podcast about them implies otherwise. [Banjo music fades out.] [Biz and Eric repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss the weekly topic.]
biz
This week, I am welcoming Eric O’Keeffe, a.k.a. Mr. Eric, who has worked with kids since he started teaching karate at age 14. He has directed a gymnastics school in Brooklyn, a children’s theatre in Manhattan, and a countrywide theatre program in Los Angeles and now he hosts and producers the podcast What If World, stories for kids. Working most nights while having to look after something that lives in his house. But we’re going to find out more about that once we get going. Welcome, welcome, welcome, Eric! [Laughs.]
eric o’keeffe
[Enthusiastically] Hi! Thank you so much for having me!
biz
[Laughs.] Oh my god! You’re a joy! We’re gonna just out-joy each other on this show! [Laughs.]
eric
You know what? I’m not sure if that’s possible! I’ve listened to your show and I just—your energy is amazing? And you remind me of my neighbor growing up. Her name is Diane Fazio, and she has this kind of laugh that like if we had our windows open— [Biz laughs.] —you could hear it from across the street and it just always brings such a smile to my—[Laughs.] It’s just—it’s wonderful.
biz
I used to do comedy in New York. Sketch comedy and standup. And I would go out and obviously see all of my friends and everybody would be like, “We always know when Biz is in the audience.” [Eric laughs.] “And we know we’ve done something good! And it’s like, if we get through a whole show and we haven’t heard the Biz laugh…” Right? And I’m just like—so then I have to make sure I’m laughing. So I wanna know—who lives in your house?
eric
Okay. Okay. All the creatures—I’ll start from oldest to youngest. [Biz laughs.] It goes: me, my wife, and then we’ve got a dog named Fred. He’s a 13-year-old pug mix. He’s very smelly. Then his sister Ginger, another kind of beagle mix. Less smelly. Then there’s Otis. He’s a cat that we never see because of the dogs. And then there’s— [Biz laughs.] —my son, Callum, who’s 17 months old. And then there’s a baby on the way—another boy—so technically he’s still living in the house but also within Karen, my wife.
biz
[Laughs.] Yes. Taking up—invading one person’s space just a little more. Just a little more than somebody else’s.
eric
I just feel like I have to give her the credit.
biz
Well, you should. [Laughs.]
eric
It’s occupying space and she’s doing all the work and I’m just trying to help.
biz
How old is the child that is there right now? Your son is 7—did you say 17 months?
eric
17 months. So yeah, they’re gonna be pretty close together.
biz
Yeah, what—oh, yeah they are. [Laughs.] [Eric laughs.] I’m laughing at you. [Eric laughs.] So the… I gotta ask—I don’t know why I’m making pinch-y fingers. But I am wondering—I was never good, when I had little children in my house, at the month thing. So we’re talking like a year and change. Right?
eric
Yeah. A year and a half. I used to work in that gymnastics school I used to work at. We needed to know the months so like… yeah. So it always sticks in my head. Even though I feel like after 18 months it’s kind of probably a little pretentious to say how many months your kid is? Just be like, “They’re a year and a half!” [Biz laughs.] Y’know? I can’t help myself, though! It’s just programmed into me! [Laughs.]
biz
I’m always like, I dunno. Walking? Talking? I dunno. Where are they? ‘Cause it’s all different, turns out. This was a big surprise. Big shock to me when I had kids. That the second one was gonna be different than the first. And I’m not lying. I really did think that they were gonna be pretty much the same in a lot of ways? That was disappointing. [Laughs.]
eric
Oh boy! Oh no! ‘Cause Cal is like so good!
biz
There’s you—yeah, I know! [Laughs.] Same here! I know! Everybody who’s listened to the show for a long time knows… [ominously] they’re different. [Regular voice] Okay. So that is very exciting news. By the way.
eric
Thank you!
biz
And I would like you to know that I think you guys are doing a great job. Because it’s about—it’s a lot! It’s a lot. In the best of circumstances, it’s a lot.
eric
It’s a lot! [Both laugh.]
biz
So. You… have a podcast that is a storytelling podcast for kids. What If World. And—[Laughs.] You are like a one-man band. It is the best. All these great characters keeping up—we are big storytellers in our house. My husband has been doing toothbrushing stories with the kids and they’re epic and they go on for years and there’s like Yogurt Mountains and like, y’know, all kind of like stories within stories within stories. So I understand how it could start. [Laughs.] But we’re weirdos. Like— [Eric laughs.] —so I understand how it starts in this house. Talk to me about how it started in your house and what led to the podcast.
eric
Well first off, weirdos are amazing.
biz
Oh I know. I love weirdos.
eric
We all gotta embrace our inner weird. That’s what makes us special. [Biz laughs.] And I was busy embracing my inner weird by telling stories to my nephew. This is, y’know, obviously before I had kids. And I moved across country. I missed him terribly. And he was just starting up preschool and he was having—just transitional issues, as kids often do. And I was just looking for a way to connect to him again. So he would sort of give me an idea or a question or a suggestion about a story that he would want, and then I would just jump into it. My secret was that I was talking to his mom on the DL and I was getting all the details about what was going on with his life and if he was having any struggles with anything at school. So then I would kind of work in lessons about—y’know, so the spider would realize that it’s okay to speak in front of the class! Or whatever. [Biz laughs.] And I was having such a blast doing it and we were doing it every week and my then-girlfriend—now wife—was like, “Maybe you should do something with this!” [Biz laughs.] And I had no idea how to do anything. But she, fortunately, had edited video and audio in Brooklyn when we lived in Brooklyn. And just kind of made an episode. And I literally cried the first time— [Biz laughs.] ‘Cause I was like, “I just said dumb things and you—yeah! And now it’s like a story!” And then it took about, like, a year and a half for her to teach me to do the same thing.
biz
Yeah! I was gonna say! [Both laugh.] Was she willing to make that commitment after the first episode! Yeah!
eric
It was—she’s just so amazing and I’m so grateful to her. Because it was about—I think it was after episode 72 that I was finally editing every single episode by myself.
biz
Oof.
eric
And the rest of the time was—I was working and she was working and I would record on my one day off and she would edit on the weekends and that was the whole dynamic. So, oh. It was a rough, rough stretch. But I learned a lot along the way and now it’s finally, y’know, my job. Which is just sort of the dream.
biz
It is! It’s a good dream. And you do it very well. It can be… I mean, if I am correct, your background clearly is theatre. Besides—[Laughs.] And as a theatre person myself, it is very… y’know. There come these moments in our lives where ya have to go, “Alright. What am I really doing?” And how can—“Is it gonna be possible to make it—make there be some sort of common ground between the things that you love and, y’know, survival.” So it really comes through in the podcast. And now that you’re making the podcast and it’s not your nephew—you talked about—you take ideas from kids. Right? They call in. They leave messages and you take those ideas and you turn them into stories. With your nephew, you were able to sort of root around behind the scenes to work in some lessons. I know you’re not calling all these kids’ parents to work in lessons. How are you… how are you sort of creating these—they’re very—they’re awesome! And complicated! And like, it’s a lotta characters! So… talk to me about the process of actually making these and what you’re hoping each of the stories, like, achieves for the kids.
eric
Yeah. So y’know, they call in with these “What if?” questions and I—at first the show was purely improvised and—but that was just hard to keep up.
biz
Yeah. You can’t keep up with that. [Laughs.]
eric
Yeah. So eventually—so now I—it’s still unscripted, but now I do—I take the questions and I just kinda—I just am like, okay. I’ve got my two questions. Either Karen picks ‘em out or I pick ‘em out.” And then I just kinda marinate on them for a while and I try to find what’s going on in the world or oftentimes just what’s going on with me personally. Or with Cal, my son. Even though he’s so young, it’s not really directed at kids that age. But it just takes me time. And I mean you know parents. We don’t have a lot of it these days. [Biz laughs.] So that’s why a lot of it happens at night when I’m finally like, [gasps] “Wait! Oh! I’ve got it! Yes!” And I’m like, “I gotta get to the studio!” And like, “Karen, please put in headphones so I can record!” And she—y’know. She’s wonderful. Have I said that yet? [Biz laughs.]
biz
I like that you keep coming back to this fact. This very important fact. Good job. [Laughs.]
eric
[Through laughter] Thank you.
biz
Wow! So a lot of it is… I mean, I can understand the improv. But there are… you’ve got some themes that go through. I mean, these are recurring characters.
eric
Yeah. Yeah. Recurring characters and recurring themes. I mean, that theme that you were talking about—for grown-ups—about how we have to finally figure out what we’re doing with our lives? I mean, I actually—that’s a theme that sort of recurs in What If World, too. Because I think dreams are tremendously important and I think it’s also important that we see that as we grow up, so do our dreams. And there’s so many different ways of taking what we’ve learned and applying it in different jobs and different opportunities with different friends. And we just—we grow along the way. So a lot of it is just, “Let’s approach our lives with empathy and with passion and pursue the things that we love. And also try to be open to change and new experiences.”
biz
That’s hard! [Laughs.]
eric
Yeah! That’s hard! That’s hard! So each story—y’know, when you listen to the story you’ll be like, “Oh, he’s said that lesson like six times.” And I’m like, “Well, yeah, kids need to hear that lesson six hundred times!”
biz
Adults need to hear it five thousand times. So like, yeah. No, no, no. [Eric laughs.] Long game. Long game. With all of these things. I gotta tell ya, it comes across that you like kids. I do, too. I think kids rock. [Laughs.]
eric
Yeah! They do!
biz
I think they’re the best. So with that said, like… people put out a lot of garbage for kids. [Eric laughs.] You have a very young one. But I know that they’re already sending garbage your son’s way. And there’s just so much more. So much more garbage! So… let’s talk about, like… the—it’s a dumb question. But the benefits of making quality—quality entertainment for… kids. Like, why is it—why is that important?
eric
Yeah! Yeah. I think—y’know, kids really want to be listened to? And they—so I know I’m only just hearing this one question, whereas with Teddy—or when I have a child as a guest on the show it—y’know, it’s constant back and forth. Constant input. But I want to treat their questions seriously, even if it turns into a very silly story. And they—like, having something that’s just a little high-quality that’s got a little more work put into it, I just think—y’know, it makes them feel heard? They—and also I just—for anyone out there thinking about making a podcast of their own—y’know, kids have a very, very strong—an innate sense of what sounds good and what doesn’t? And if you do have—y’know, if your mic quality is bad or you’re just working out your compression still and stuff like that—it’ll take kids a lot longer to get into your show, too! [Biz laughs.] So from a logistics standpoint, too, it’s important to—because they know that—it’s very hard to fool kids. Except if you put—maybe if you put really splashy stuff, loud, bright things. But with a podcast you kinda can’t do that.
biz
No, yeah. No, you have to connect with them with your voice. Which is… I think at first I thought, “Well, that’s weird.” But then I realized I used to—[Laughs.] I was such a kid of the late ‘70s and ‘80s. I used to go to the mall and there would be these—[Laughs.] These weird phone banks in the middle of malls. They looked like trees or they look like—y’know, shaped to look like stuff. And there’d be one or two phones in them and you could pick up the phone and they would tell you a story. Like, there’d be a recorded story or a joke. Right? And it would be very quick and very short. And there also used to be a phone line you could call. As a kid. And they’ll tell you a joke or a little story time. And I remember doing that and I also listened to a ton of records that had stories on it. And… like, sort of interactive experiences on records. And I—it actually does make sense, even though it’s coming from this very modern device that makes me be like, “Get out of your hands, children! Go out and play!” Right? But it can be used for good with a podcast!
eric
Yeah. I really do—kids are listening to more podcasts and while I still like to encourage them to get out and live their lives—but it’s also—it’s hard right now! I mean, we’re not through this pandemic yet. Not quite. And they need some healthy alternatives. [Biz laughs.] They also—you were talking about quality programming and this is, y’know, from a parenting standpoint this is something I’m obsessing over all the time. Thinking about as my kids get older. Because—so I have to admit, I’m a fan of your show and the last episode that I listened to about how you wish you could just talk about Supernatural? Y’know?
biz
Yeah. [Laughs.] I could! Maybe it’ll be a bonus show this year. [Laughs.]
eric
Well I’m just saying—like, let’s do it right now a little bit! Y’know? ‘Cause—
biz
Oh. Okay. I have not seen the last two episodes! [Laughs.]
eric
Wait! You haven’t seen the finale?
biz
I have not seen the finale. I think I have two left. And I just like—don’t ask why I haven’t seen it. It’s just parenting. Don’t tell me!
eric
Okay. I won’t ruin the finale.
biz
Will they kill God? [Laughs.] I love it!
eric
I won’t do that. But here’s—so here’s the thing! Like, I—huge fan of Supernatural. Right? I mean, I—it was formative in my college years and I just thought the monsters were so cool and it was episodic but had this wide sweeping arc. After the first five seasons it did kinda start to dip a little bit? Right?
biz
But I don’t care ‘cause they’re still—they’re still my boys! Sam and Dean!
eric
Such a guilty pleasure. I wear flannels all the time to this day, probably because— [Biz laughs.] —of Supernatural. But at the same time, y’know, as a parent I’m like—can I show this—can I really rep this show? And I do that with everything. ‘Cause Supernatural—by the end, it’s like, “Oh my gosh, this is almost entirely white cast. Almost entirely men.” Y’know. And like—
biz
Oh, I know. They kill women so fast.
eric
So fast!
biz
I mean… sooo—there was supposed to be that Supernatural spinoff with the female—and that didn’t—that didn’t happen. Which is a shame. No. I—okay. Let’s do it! Let’s—let’s—let’s derail! [Eric laughs.] I understand what you’re saying.
eric
It’s parenting, though! It’s parenting! ‘Cause we—we wanna show our kids the things that we love and are passionate about, but so much of it—I’m like, “Does it hold up? Can I in good conscience show my kids this thing that I loved so much?” And I don’t know!
biz
I know! I don’t have a good answer to that, because like… I grew up in—the needle was way off the mark with the stuff that I watched as a kid on television. And my husband, who was—[Laughs.] I joke. He was deprived television in his youth. So a couple of—never seen Happy Days. What?! Anyway, he has this list of movies that come into the house thanks to Netflix. All I’m gonna say is, we watched Smokey and the Bandit the other day.
eric
Sure.
biz
Now Smokey and the Bandit, I had watched that a bazillion times as a kid. ‘K? I knew—I knew the moment it came up that it just was not something that fit anymore. [Laughs.]
eric
Right. [Laughs.]
biz
And you’re like, “Ohhh… yeah.”
eric
Yeah, you cringe!
biz
I don’t—yeah! Ooh! Eek! I don’t— [Eric laughs.] —Oooh! Don’t wanna have to explain all this! Right? [Laughs.] And like—[Laughs.] Like—[Laughs.] I think—and with my own—with my oldest, who’s eleven, we watch stuff together and it’s really been hard to find stuff that—[sighs]. A, is like… suitable but cool enough that I also wanna watch it? Like we watched Stargirl and that was really fun. But… y’know. We’ve tried other shows where I’m like, “I can’t show you Supernatural—I’m not even sure I could show you Buffy one day!”
eric
Ohhh!
biz
Because all I can think about is the, like… rape scene in Buffy fairly early on. And like… there was just all this stuff tied—why does get to love him now? And what message is that?
eric
Yeah. Like, is Angel really a good love interest?
biz
A good guy? Yeah! And so—and then Spike! Years later? Like, is that okay? [Eric laughs.] That’s so fucked up! [Laughs.] So I don’t—I’m with you on this. But… I don’t know if this is true for you, but all of those shows… I was able to navigate regardless.
eric
Oh yes! Absolutely.
biz
So what are your thoughts on that? With—as you start thinking about things and you’re creating your own content.
eric
Yeah! That’s really the tough part. Because we wanna trust our kids and so these things can be a dialogue. Like, I watched G.I. Joe. Like, that—I had—I still, in fact, at my mom’s house, I have a shoebox full of G.I. Joes. And I always—when I was a kid, I was like, “Yeah! I’m gonna keep these forever!” And then I was like, “Maybe someday I’ll play with them with my own kids!” or something. Whatever. But it’s guns and it’s weird. Y’know? [Biz laughs.] It’s so—so we have to trust them. But we have to tell them, y’know, the context. Right? And maybe it’s better to—like, there are so many more inclusive shows now and—like, Dragon Prince, the show, is a cartoon show. I think might be age-appropriate. My nephew’s watching it. And I’m like, “That’s—yeah. There’s a good show.” But then also he goes and plays—what is it? Fortnite or Destiny or—y’know, just blowing people up constantly. [Biz laughs.]
biz
I know! I know!
eric
But he’s not blowing people up in real life. So…
biz
No! Well my husband and I were just talking—‘cause again, he’s been going through all these old movies. He just watched Sylvester Stallone’s Cobra and then he just watched American—Iron Eagle. Which again, very ‘80s. [Dramatically] The dad’s been kidnapped and is held in—it’s not Libya. It’s like Bilya or something. And y’know, they don’t wanna wait for negotiations. These teens are just gonna steal—commit high treason and steal this plane and just go murder people to get their dad back! [Eric laughs.] And then again—[Laughs.] Again! Cobra with Stallone is just like, y’know, I—I am the law. I don’t—the bad guy’s like, “Yeah, you’ve caught me, but I now get to be judged by a judge and jury!” “I’m your only judge.” [Makes shooting noise.] And I’m like, “This is why we had people marching in the Capitol thinking that they could take it into their own hands with guns!” And you—you’re like, “Oh, this is why people think that violence in policing is normal.” Right? Like—
eric
Right! Like, what are we normalizing by just showing these things? So I think—to your point—it is okay—like, we are aware that these things that we loved are problematic. And so if we show them to our children—but with that same dialogue happening. So it’s like active. Like, “What did you think about that?” “Oh, it was cool! He shot everyone!” “Was it, though?”
biz
“Was it?” [Laughs.]
eric
“Was it?”
biz
Well don’t stumble into the mistakes I made, which was showing these things way too early and then trying to have these conversations. Half the time we’ll turn something on and Kat, my oldest, will be like, “That’s not nice. That’s wrong.” I mean, she’ll like—they already have—
eric
Wow!
biz
Because the kids right now are being—all the shows they see are like, y’know, “Be kind and be nice and this is okay and this is nice” and they—both of my kids recognize when the show is missing diversity. And this stuff. Which is great. I mean, this is just—it’s great. But then it’s like, “Okay, well now how do I have the discussion when you already know the other side? Like, what it’s supposed to look like? How this is supposed to be? And any explanation I try to give you as to why we once watched it is kind of still bullshit.” [Laughs.] Y’know, it may be not justifiable—which, Justified. I also loved that show. [Eric laughs.] I like people getting beat up for good reasons to be justified? Okay. So… I’m gonna bring us back to the show. To the podcast. And creating content for kids. I want to talk about sort of the… what I would consider sort of the anchor of the show, which is that question: “What if?” Right? And I would… love to hear your thoughts on the importance of that question?
eric
Yeah! Well—so the show starts off with What If World and the theme song and, y’know, and then it ends—I say, y’know, “Until we meet again, keep wondering!” And those are sort of the bookends for a reason. Because I think curiosity is incredibly important. Open-mindedness is incredibly important. The ability to not only admit that we’re wrong but sort of seek out new information in case what we know to be right isn’t! Y’know? Which is so common these days! And I—y’know, I mean, I’m a— [Biz laughs.] —I’m a straight, white, cis-male. I’ve had so much that I have to learn and that I am still trying to learn and that I want to impart upon my son and my other son on his way. And also, you know what? That’s just their gender assigned at birth! Y’know, they’re—
biz
Yeah! Oh honey, it can go anywhere.
eric
Yeah! [Biz laughs.] Exactly! But these are things—when I grew up, I had to tell people—my favorite color, right now, and has always been, the color purple. But when I was a kid, I said that my favorite colors were red and blue because I thought I would get made fun of if I said my favorite color was purple!
biz
Oh my god.
eric
Like, how dumb is that?
biz
I know. But that just… y’know. I don’t know if that, per se, is dumb. Because as kids we create all kind of crazy anxiety in our own heads?
eric
That’s true.
biz
But that anxiety does stem from having heard or having seen… y’know. Even the most casual of comments, y’know, can get stuck in kids’ heads. It’s embedded in us. But anyway. I digress. Go ahead.
eric
No! It’s—I think it’s important. I want my children to—y’know, I hope that they can grow up in a world that’s more understanding and—but I also know that once they get to school there’s so much that’s out of my control! So I just—y’know, I wanna prepare them for that. But I don’t know how other kids are gonna look at them. I mean, I have a sort of higher-pitched voice. I’m small. It might be hard to tell from this video— [Biz laughs.] —‘cause I got a beard and stuff so I’m really cool. But—
biz
That’s right. Well you made all your furniture very small so you look gigantic! [Laughs.]
eric
But I’m like 130 pounds soaking wet. I’m 5’6”. I have a slightly high-pitched voice. I did theatre. Y’know, I was a target! I—y’know, I was—a lot of people called me a lot of names. And I—but I also… my parents—my family loved me enough to know that it was okay for me to be weird and they encouraged me to be myself and I… I hope that when my children get to school and just get out there in the real world that they don’t get crushed down by kids disapproving of who they end up being, which is way too early to tell.
biz
Yeah. I think that—that is the hope. Right? I grew up in the deep South. And we—y’know. I was not normal! [Laughs.] [Eric laughs.] I still don’t wear makeup. But it was a lot of stuff that—again—same as you. I was a tomboy so lots of people definitely called me lots of things. Y’know. And… I didn’t do all the things that other girls were doing, etcetera. And I did theatre and I wanted to make people laugh and I didn’t care about falling down or getting dirty or any of those things. And my parents also let my sister and I just grow up to be, y’know, weirdo, feminist, crazy people. And… I attribute my survival—my emotional survival—[Laughs.] On that unconditional love. And I… and acceptance. And as the kids—my kids get older—and it doesn’t always work. Y’know? They’re still—they’re not impervious to assholes. Right? And they’re not impervious from being jerks.
eric
Sure! Yeah!
biz
But I am with you. That, god, I just hope long game. If I’m just steady, like, “It’s okay that you are doing whatever it is that you are doing right now,” that long game they’ll be alright. [Laughs.]
eric
Yeah. No! And those are the recurring lessons in What If World that’s just—like, personal strength. Acceptance. Accommodation and understanding of others. Things that—y’know, my parents did a good job of imparting on me, but also partly because—y’know, we had advantages! I mean, we weren’t rich but we—I mean, I know that I have a lot of privilege that I grew up with and I have to, y’know, grapple with that and try to make amends for that for the rest of my life. And I just want people to understand, y’know, kids to know that it’s okay—y’know, we’re grown-ups and I still have these same anxieties. And I—but I still try to find myself every day. And when I am lucky enough to interact with another human being—[Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] [Through laughter] Which is so rare! I feel like I can take them in and if I am dumb enough to put my foot in my mouth in some way, I can be like—I can apologize? And take it upon myself to learn to not do that again. Y’know, not put it on everyone else in the world. It’s our own responsibility. So there’s a lot of that. Like—like, learn! Teach yourself. And maybe this podcast will help encourage you to do that and tell you that you’re on the right path, but also there’s just gonna be a lot of bad dad jokes along the way. So.
biz
Oh my god. There are so many puns! [Eric laughs.] You kitty litter-ally got me out of my chair. [Eric laughs.] With one of the episodes. I was like, “Did he just say kitty litter-ally? How have I missed this cat pun?” Alright. Eric, I have to say thank you so much for coming on. Obviously we could talk forever. Now I am thinking maybe for the MaxFun Drive—which is coming eventually—the bonus show—I think maybe you should be my guest and we should do a Supernatural show!
eric
Oh my gosh! Are you kidding? I would adore it! I would adore it! We could review media—like, yeah. But you have to watch the rest!
biz
But—yeah! I gotta watch the rest, but then I’ll get my flannel and I’ll turn on all of my Kansas music and talk about women in a demeaning way— [Eric laughs.] —and we will murder some monsters. It will be a delight. Until then—Gabe’s already writing it down! I love it! [Eric laughs.] Until then, we will make sure that everybody knows where—everybody knows—I know you all know how to find podcasts. But we’ll make sure we spell the name correctly. [Laughs.] What If World. As well as link up to anything else that you would like people to know about. But overall, if there is one thing that I can assure you that you are doing is that you are putting a little kindness out in the world. And that is—you’re doing a very good job.
eric
Thank you. That—that really means a lot. And I feel the same way about your show. Your show has made me weep. So thank you for doing it. [Biz laughs.] In a good way! In a good way! In a camaraderie—
biz
No, I’ve wept on the show openly. [Eric laughs.] Don’t worry. [Laughs.] Somewhere back there—people know it by heart, the episode where I came back from my second child and was just… broken. It was like, oh, broken. Broken toy.
eric
Yeah. Well, maybe talk to me in a few months. We’ll see. [Laughs.]
biz
Yeah! [Through laughter] Come back when you’re—[Laughs.] Alright. Thank you so much and I think maybe we’ll have to talk again really soon.
eric
I’d love that. I’d love that. Thank you.
biz
Okay. Bye.
eric
Bye!
music
“Ones and Zeroes” by “Awesome.” Steady, driving electric guitar with drum and woodwinds. [Music fades out.]
music
Cheerful ukulele and whistling plays in background.
theresa
One Bad Mother is supported in part by Grove Collaborative, which delivers healthy home, beauty, and personal care products directly to you.
biz
I can remember the moment I was reaching for my skin lotion and I noticed that there wasn’t a little cruelty free label on it. [Theresa gasps.] And twelve-year-old Biz just started screaming at me. When Grove came about, it was—it was just the best thing that ever happened to me! Because I didn’t have to go doing a ton of research on a ton of different sites. They had already done all the research. Shown me how all the different products that I wanted to replace in my house were environmentally friendly and animal friendly. As a result of Grove, I’ve been able to change all of my laundry products, all of my hand soap, all of my dish soap. Food. Wrapping. Packaging. All of that. And it’s been a delight!
theresa
So making the switch to natural products has really never been easier. And for a limited time, when One Bad Mother listeners go to Grove.co/badmother, you’ll get to choose a free gift with your first order of $30 or more. Use our special code.
theresa
Hey, you know what it’s time for! This week’s genius and fails! This is the part of the show where we share our genius moment of the week, as well as our failures, and feel better about ourselves by hearing yours. You can share some of your own by calling 206-350-9485. That’s 206-350-9485.
biz
Hello, Theresa! Happy spring break! Woooo! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
theresa
Wow. Which spring break feels more like spring break—this one, or the one last year?
biz
Oh. Both of them were horrible. But this year—this year I am so content in the amount of television and videogames we’re gonna sit in, in this house? Like, I’m so okay. And we got a bonus week of spring week. So bonus week! Bonus!
theresa
Yay.
biz
I know. With a big fat email that said, “Don’t go anywhere ‘cause we’re gonna try and do in-person learning when you come back.” [Laughs.] It’s like, “Who’s going anywhere?” [Theresa sighs.] All that said, let’s kick off a very safe spring break. Theresa, genius me.
clip
[Dramatic, swelling music in background.] Biz: Wow! Oh my God! Oh my God! I saw what you did! Oh my God! I’m paying attention! Wow! You, mom, are a genius. Oh my God, that’s fucking genius! [Biz and Theresa repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss their respective genius moments of the week.]
theresa
Okay. So my kids’ spring breaks are all mixed up. A few of them overlap. [Biz laughs.] Like, a few days of them overlap, I think. So we’re not quite there yet with Curtis and Oscar, my two youngest kids. And this morning I started a new routine with them where they got themselves dressed first thing and then got their own breakfast. They are seven and four. Y’know. I would say that I feel like the seven-year-old? We’re a little late on getting that going. Four-year-old? Maybe a little on the early side. Depends on your kids. But they did it today, and this is one of those “who knows what lies ahead.” But it went great today. And they did such a good job. I was really proud of them. And I was proud of myself for trying something. Trying to make things better.
biz
Hey! Good job!
theresa
Thanks.
biz
I like living in the day. And as far as I know, what happened today, Theresa, is gonna happen tomorrow and the next day. In fact, we can just forever say it is March 26th. No one’s going to call us out on that. I think that is amazing. And I predict success every day going forward. [Theresa laughs.] I love this.
crosstalk
Theresa: Thank you. Thanks, Biz. Biz: I—you’re welcome! I mean it.
biz
I mean it. Gonna will it to happen. [Theresa laughs.] Okay. After a really long time, we finally told Ellis that both of the snails that are in our house—the water snail who’s been around for like three years or something? That snail has been around forever—died. He died like a month ago. And he died. And no one cares about the things that live in the fish tank until, y’know, something’s dead. And then suddenly they’re like, “We need more fish!” And then he also had a snail that we found outside. I think it was dead the moment we brought it into the house. But we just didn’t say anything. Right? So I finally—I just said to Stefan, “I need you to be president of this emotional experience.”
theresa
Nice. Good.
biz
And he was. And the snails are gone. And even better, the fish tank is gone. I just said, “It’s broken now. I’m so sorry.”
crosstalk
Theresa: The fish tank… is gone?! Biz: This was the last—this was the last thing to stay alive in the fish tank.
biz
And I just lied. I said—and they were like, “Can we go get more fish?” And I said, “Oh, it’s broken. This is broken now. Maybe one day we can get another fish tank.” But—
theresa
Biz!
biz
I know!
theresa
I feel like I need to send you flowers or something!
biz
To put where the fish tank once was!
crosstalk
Theresa: Yes! This is huge! Biz: I have put plants there!
biz
I have put plants there. It is so lovely. It is—it is such a nice space. I know.
theresa
What… an end of an era.
biz
I know! [Laughs.]
theresa
I am so happy for you. This is great.
biz
Yeah. It is.
theresa
This is great.
crosstalk
Biz: Just—that’s how we— [Laughs.] Theresa: Good… job.
biz
Thank you so much. [Laughs.]
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] Hi, Biz and Theresa! I’m calling in with a genius. And I’m really hoping it stays a genius and doesn’t sneak up and turn into a fail because there’s so much room for that. But in this moment, I am going to count it as a genius because it’s Friday. It’s raining. And I really need one. But I am going to walk into my house in a moment with hot chocolate for my children, who are doing virtual school. And it’s been a long year and they’ve been virtual all year. And just woke up kind of sad with a rainy day and when I went out to pick up the groceries, I thought, “Well, I’ll be by Starbucks and they really like hot chocolate and I’ll get this for them and surprise them.” And so hopefully this plan goes well in the next five minutes and doesn’t end up with me wearing the hot chocolate or the dog eating the hot chocolate or the hot chocolate exploding— [Biz laughs.] —or one of the many ways I can anticipate it going wrong. But for now, it is a genius. And I think that sometimes we need to celebrate the [through laughter] potential geniuses just as much as the ones that actually work. Thank you for this show. You guys are doing a great job.
biz
I agree!
theresa
I agree, too. Also sometimes that’s the only time you have to call it in.
biz
Exactly. [Theresa laughs.] Exactly. You wanna get ahead of it. The celebrating. It’s like Theresa and her kids making their own breakfast for the rest of their lives. Celebrate it now. You are so nice. You’re doing such a good job. Y’know? Just being aware of everybody’s moods and a little—hot chocolate’s such a nice little treat. It’s easy. And I get it. Like, I get the—all the potential disasters that could arise. As well as just, y’know, at least in this house, the potential for just shitty unappreciative reactions from young children. Right? Like that—y’know. [Mockingly] Part of their development. [Regular voice] But [through laughter] at the same time, it’s like, “Hello! I’m a really nice mom!” Anyway. [Laughs.] I’m gonna assume it was all perfect and beautiful. You are doing—you’re doing such a good job.
theresa
Yeah. You are.
biz
Failures.
theresa
[Dramatic orchestral music plays in the background.] Theresa: [In a voice akin to the Wicked Witch of the West] Fail. Fail. Fail. FAIL! [Timpani with foot pedal engaged for humorous effect.] Biz: [Calmly] You suck! [Biz and Theresa repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss their respective failures of the week.]
biz
Fail me, Theresa.
theresa
Okay. So I just need to acknowledge the failure that led to my genius moment that I talked about. Which was that now that all three of my kids are back in some amount of school—they’re all back in a little bit of school and none of them have the same schedule and none of them go to the same school. [Biz laughs.] And I’ve been dreading this moment. Because even though I want them all in school, I still, like—it was so much work to get things organized originally to have everybody go back to school? And to have everybody in school. And now I’m all out of those routines and I don’t have it together. And so this past week there were just—there were a couple mornings where—[sighs]. I don’t know. I think I’ve gotten—things have gotten better at—I’ve talked about how hard mornings are for me at length on this show. So I’m not even gonna go— [Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] —back and uncover all of that? But they are really challenging for me. And what I realized this week was that we are doing a lot better in that there isn’t as much, like, resistance? To doing school and going to school? As there has [through laughter] historically been in our house? So I don’t have to do as much, like, co-regulating and helping people emotionally get themselves in gear to go to school as I have in the past? But what is happening is that still none of them are doing anything towards getting themselves to go to school? Like, it’s still me. [Biz laughs.] Doing all of the stuff for all of them. Like, all of—I’m doing—I’m like—with each of them for every step making each of those things happen. And I think because during the pandemic things were so different and there was so much less happening? So much less demanded of them as far as leaving the house at a certain time. And just because of them being off schedule, it was often just one kid I was getting ready. And that would be more manageable. And what happened this week was I had to get everyone ready to go and I just couldn’t. It was so stupid. I was so mad at myself. I was like, “This is so stupid.” And they’re playing. And they’re really sweet and they’re just having their morning and they’re fine with going to school, but nobody’s helping me. Nobody. So that was definitely a moment of acknowledging that was where I was at and that that was not going to work? And that we couldn’t have mornings like that? I just won’t be able to do that? So there ya have it.
biz
Good. How did it make ya feel?
theresa
Horrible.
crosstalk
Biz: It’s horrible, isn’t it? Theresa: Horrible.
theresa
It took the whole rest of the day to recover from how I felt for that two-hour window in the morning.
biz
Yeah. ‘Cause it’s like this big mix of—for me at least, I immediately go to, “Where did I go wrong? Why aren’t these—these children are completely capable! There are children out there who are getting up and milking cows at the crack of dawn!” Right? Like, feeding chickens! And mine—mine can’t—I don’t—I don’t know. I don’t know what it is they can’t do, but it’s anything that’s helpful. [Theresa laughs.] And then I think, “Well that’s on me.” Isn’t it? I dunno. You feel like I’m doing a good job every once in a while until you have to—I dunno—see evidence of it.
theresa
It’s hard. Yeah.
biz
I don’t like it. Okay. I’m gonna make my fail very short and sweet. Y’know, we had snails. Dead snails laying around the house for a while. And what prompted Stefan to finally take some action was when Ellis came out of their room and said, “My room smells really bad.” [Theresa gasps, then laughs.] I was like, “It is the rotting carcass of a snail. That is what it is.” So… yeah. And who didn’t know that? We’ve already learned the lesson of insects—dead insects in your house. Like, big ones. We’ve already shared those fails in the past. So… we know better. I guess we just don’t care.
theresa
Except apparently you don’t.
biz
I don’t. We don’t know better and we don’t care. [Laughs.] So anyway. There ya go.
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] Hey, this is a fail and I come from a long line of people who have also had this fail. [Biz laughs.] We’re not going anywhere lately? I’m not sure if you guys realize we’re in a pandemic, but I took my kids to go get some takeout and they’re in the car with me and they’re excited. And I’ve got big kids. Like, they’re nine and eleven. And I say to them, when we get out of the car, “Okay, make sure you have all of your food and stuff and help me carry it into the house.” So I think we have everything and lo and behold—this was a week ago? And I got in my car this morning because I have to drive to my job that I still have to go to and it’s been getting warm. Somebody left chocolate milk in this car and I’m going to get my vaccination tonight and I have to try to clean out this car ‘cause it’s a drive-through! I’m gonna be driving through and I know they’re gonna have the mask on but they’re gonna smell the stink wagon. [Biz laughs.] So that’s what I’m dealing with. I failed at trying to let my children out of the house. We’re all just feral now. I don’t even know what to do. You guys are all doing a fantastic job and there is spoiled milk in my car. Bye.
biz
Yeah. I—I like how you prefaced this fail with, “I got big kids.” [Laughs.] That’s—like somehow—I know that my wishful thinking is, “I got big kids, and so they’ll start doing all the things that they demand more responsibility to do.” Even when it’s not convenient for them to do it.
theresa
Yeah. What she’s saying is, it was reasonable for her to just tell them to bring all their stuff in. Like, they’re at an age where she shouldn’t have to then go back and look. But…
biz
But.
theresa
But.
biz
But. But, but, but-but, but, but, but. [Laughs.] Good! That makes me feel better! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] That your children are also doing horrible things like this. Yay! I feel better. [Laughs.] You’re doing a horrible job with expectations of your children. [Laughs.] Oh, but congratulations on getting a vaccine.
music
“Mom Song” by Adira Amram. Mellow piano music with lyrics. You are the greatest mom I’ve ever known. I love you, I love you. When I have a problem, I call you on the phone. I love you, I love you. [Music fades out.]
music
Inspirational keyboard music plays in background.
biz
One Bad Mother is supported in part by ThirdLove. ThirdLove uses the measurements of millions of women to design bras with all-day comfort and support in over 80 sizes. Do you mean it’s not “one size fits all”? [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
theresa
Oh, you guys have heard me talk about ThirdLove. I love all of my ThirdLove bras so much. They have a fit-finder quiz on their website and they just updated a new and improved version of this quiz and it’s called The Fitting Room. They also have loungewear now. It’s made with premium cotton fabrics. Available in drapey, easy-fit knits in sizes extra-small to 3x.
biz
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theresa
Go to ThirdLove.com/mother now to find your perfect-fitting bra. And get 20% off your first purchase.
biz
That’s ThirdLove.com/mother to 20% off todayyy! [Music ends.]
promo
Music: Guitar strums. John Moe: Hey, it’s John Moe. And look, these are challenging times for our mental and emotional health. I get it. That’s why I’m so excited for my new podcast, Depresh Mode. We’re tackling depression, anxiety, trauma, stress—the kinds of things that are just super common but don’t get talked about nearly enough. Conversations that are illuminating, honest, and sometimes pretty funny. With folks like Patton Oswalt, Open Mike Eagle, and Kelsey Darragh. Speaker 2: Now I can kinda go like, “Oh, yeah, there’s that thing where I feel like I’m in a videogame and my hands aren’t real and I’m living The Truman Show. Okay. This, too, shall pass.” John: Plus psychiatrists, psychologists, and all kinds of folks. On Depresh Mode, we’re working together. Learning. Helping each other out. We’re a team! Join our team! Depresh Mode, from Maximum Fun. Wherever you get your podcasts.
promo
Music: Cheerful, jazzy, old-timey music plays in background. Freddie Wong: Hey, you like movies? How about coming up with movie ideas over the course of an hour? ‘Cause that’s what we do every week on Story Break, a writers’ room podcast where three Hollywood professionals have an hour to come up with a pitch for a movie or TV show based off of totally zany prompts. Will Campos: Like that time we reimagined Star Wars based on our phones’ autocomplete! Will: Luke Skywalker is a family man and it’s Star Wars but it’s a good idea. [Multiple people laugh.] Matt Arnold: Okay. How about a time we wrote the story of a bunch of Disney Channel Original Movies based solely on the title and the poster? Matt: Okay, Sarah Hyland is a 50-foot woman. Let’s just go with it, guys. Freddie: Or the time we finally cracked the Adobe Photoshop Feature Film. Matt: Stamp Tool is your Woody, and then the autofill— Freddie: Ohhhh. Matt: —Is the new Buzz Lightyear! [Multiple people laugh.] Freddie: Join us as we have a good time imagining all the movies Hollywood is [accusatory voice] too cowardly to make! [Dramatic voice] Story Break comes out every Thursday on Maximum Fun. [Regular voice] I don’t know why I’m using this voice now. [Music ends.]
biz
Alright, everybody. Let’s cuddle up and brace ourselves for a mom having a breakdown.
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] Hi, One Bad Mother. This is a rant. I called a while ago. This is one bad daughter. And I had to move in—my daughter and I had to move in with my dad over the pandemic and my dad is not doing well. My daughter is having panic attacks. And major anxiety. I think the stress of the year is finally catching up with her and I got her a therapist and hopefully that’s gonna help. But every day I feel like I’m just… trying to manage everybody so that they don’t fall apart. My dad, my daughter, and obviously trying to manage myself but that’s a lot harder. So I just feel really overwhelmed. I’m happy that the vaccine is here and hopefully things will get better as far as the pandemic goes, but it’s still so stressful knowing that things are gonna change again. And that’s it. Thanks for your show. You’re doing a good job.
biz
First off, so are you. And I appreciate you kind of calling back and checking in. There’s no way we could forget your call. [Laughs.] When you had to move in with your dad and complicated relationships. But I really wanna kinda focus in on something you said, and that was, “It’s great that change is coming, but that change causes anxiety.” Right? With that change comes a whole new set of pivots and adapting that once again we don’t know what it’s gonna look like. And we’ve spent so many years on this show talking about having to pivot and all those pivots were within sort of a world and culture that we understood and had sort of some set rules of, “Yes, you can go to a park.” [Laughs.] ”Yes. If you need to, you can call a babysitter.” Right? Or you could leave your kids at your parents’ house. Or just whatever. Whatever. And those things are all gone. And… then we had to really navigate the unknown. And now you’re right! I have been anxious since they started saying the vaccines are coming out. And I appreciate all the, like, “Yay! Vaccines!” But I—it’s gonna be really hard to get back to any kind of routine that makes sense, and that’s not just true for me but that’s true for the kids. For Stefan. So I really hear you and see you and I think it’s important that we all acknowledge that that’s happening. I mean, Theresa, you just got through talking about having to get all your kids to three different schools. I don’t—there’s only one of you! I don’t understand, physically, how that’s—‘cause it used to be that Gracie did a carpool thing to their school.
theresa
Right. Which we can’t do anymore.
biz
But you can’t do that anymore. Right? And so that’s just one example. Of our returning to school. Our kids aren’t going back on the same days, even though it’s the same school. [Laughs.] And they— [Laughs.] And there’s one moment in which one has to be at one location of the school and the other one has to be at the other location of the school for their drop-offs and pickups. So not the same place. Who… what’s that gonna… what’s that gonna be? But I do wanna say, I think you’re remarkable. I mean, hey, good job getting a therapist for your child. Y’know. That is some A+ parenting right now. And I think that’s gonna be remarkably helpful for them. And for you.
theresa
Yeah. I mean, there’s—I think maybe what we’re feeling right now is this sense of hope without answers. Like… there is hope now. That’s… so different. From months ago. Y’know? We can see that things are changing and there’s a lot of reasons to be positive. But uncertainty is one of the hardest things. _[Laughs.]Just one of the hardest things. [Biz laughs.]_ So… we’re allowing it to not make sense right now.
biz
[Laughs.] Yeah. God. Ahhh! You’re right! you’re right. It’s like not knowing what to do when the circumstances were much more dire feeling. Still not knowing what to do even though everything’s supposed to be very hopeful. That’s almost—it’s like that place where everything—at the beginning, where I was like, “Everything feels so normal in my house and I look out and it’s beautiful and sunny, yet I can’t do anything. I know there’s a killing disease out there.” [Theresa laughs.] So normalcy plus anxiety is weird. And now it’s the opposite, where it’s like— _[Laughs.]_It’s like, “Can we go out?” “I dunno! Can we?” “I don’t know!”
theresa
Kind of. Kind of not. Kind of.
biz
We shouldn’t. Spring break. Look, you’re doing an amazing job.
theresa
Yeah, you are.
biz
Theresa, you are also doing a good job. Thank you. As always. For being my friend. [Laughs.]
theresa
Thanks, Biz. You are also doing a very good job.
biz
And I will talk to you… next week when things are gonna be so much better. [Laughs.]
theresa
It’s gonna be great.
biz
It’s gonna be great! [Laughs.] Bye!
theresa
Bye!
biz
Well, everybody, what did we learn today? Ohh, y’know what I like learning? I like learning that joy and kindness and “what if”-ing and just… trying to walk through the world as learners? That’s one of my favorite things to learn. If there is one thing that has come out of this podcast for me over the years, it is… just that! It is becoming a better learner? A better listener. And a better apologizer. [Laughs.] If that’s the right—I mean, that sounds weird. But you know what I mean? I think our guest today, Eric, was talking about stepping in it. And we’ve talked about that on the show a million time. Stepping in it. Especially when there are young kids in your house and your brain isn’t functioning like maybe it used to function and then garbage comes out of your mouth and then you’re like, “Aah!” Or there are experiences in the world that we haven’t been exposed to or… or haven’t happened to us. And when someone is kind enough to reach out and say, “Uhh… that’s not… maybe we shouldn’t… I don’t think that language is right anymore.” Or—and it goes back to what we were talking about with Eric and the TV shows and the movies! The stuff we grew up with. What was okay and was part of the language, y’know, ten years ago. Twenty years ago. Sixty years ago. Thanks to being learners and listening and just trying to get better at knowing each other, we progress past those—those words. That language. And I think it is very normal and natural to constantly be learning how to be better. How to be mindful. How to seek out and walk through the world with more grace and more empathy. For all those around us. Especially those with kids. Jesus! It’s hard! [Laughs.] So sorry! It’s so hard. I also feel like I’ve been wrapping this show up on a bit of a downer recently, so let me just say—one, as I mentioned last week, the MaxFun Drive is coming. Not tomorrow, but down the road. In the show notes there is a phone number and email. We are trying to collect calls or emails from listeners that share why you support One Bad Mother during the MaxFun Drive. Why you are a donor/supporter/backer of our show. If you’re willing to share that we would greatly appreciate it. That would be a real gift to us. Also, you’re all doing a great job! Let’s get to it. Let’s get to the upper. Not the downer. You’re amazing? You’re, like, amazing. Things are weird right now and complicated and spring break is just a bullshit wording. It’s like, “Eh, it’s… y’know… Donut Day.” It means nothing! It means nothing. Right? You could have a donut any day you damn well please. Schedules are changing. Rules are changing. Schooling is definitely changing. And it’s not gonna fit for everybody right now. So let’s continue to remind ourselves that we are making the best choices that we can for our family in the moment. And those are the right choices. And… that we also have permission to change our choices when and if we ever need to. You guys are fucking amazing. Did you hear me? You’re amazing. And you are doing a good job. And I will talk to you next week. Bye!
music
“Mama Blues” by Cornbread Ted and the Butterbeans. Strumming acoustic guitar with harmonica and lyrics. I got the lowdown momma blues Got the the lowdown momma blues Gots the lowdown momma blues The lowdown momma blues. Gots the lowdown momma blues Got the lowdown momma blues You know that’s right. [Music fades somewhat, plays in background of dialogue.]
biz
We’d like to thank MaxFun; our producer, Gabe Mara; our husbands, Stefan Lawrence and Jesse Thorn; our perfect children, who provide us with inspiration to say all these horrible things; and of course, you, our listeners. To find out more about the songs you heard on today’s podcast and more about the show, please go to MaximumFun.org/onebadmother. For information about live shows, our book and press, please check out OneBadMotherPodcast.com.
theresa
One Bad Mother is a member of the Maximum Fun family of podcasts. To support the show go to MaximumFun.org/donate. [Music continues for a while before fading out.]
music
A cheerful ukulele chord.
speaker 2
Comedy and culture.
speaker 3
Artist owned—
speaker 4
—Audience supported.
About the show
One Bad Mother is a comedy podcast hosted by Biz Ellis about motherhood and how unnatural it sometimes is. We aren’t all magical vessels!
Join us every week as we deal with the thrills and embarrassments of motherhood and strive for less judging and more laughing.
Call in your geniuses and fails: 206-350-9485. For booking and guest ideas, please email onebadmother@maximumfun.org. To keep up with One Bad Mother on social media, follow @onebadmothers on Twitter and Instagram.
Get in touch with the show
onebadmother@maximumfun.org
@OneBadMothers
@onebadmothers
How to listen
Stream or download episodes directly from our website, or listen via your favorite podcatcher!
