Transcript
biz
Hi. I’m Biz.
theresa
And I’m Theresa.
biz
Due to the pandemic, we bring you One Bad Mother straight from our homes—including such interruptions as: children! Animal noises! And more! So let’s all get a little closer while we have to be so far apart. And remember—we are doing a good job.
music
“Summoning the Rawk” by Kevin MacLeod. Driving electric guitar and heavy drums. [Continues through dialogue.]
biz
This week on One Bad Mother—let’s play Never Have I Ever! Plus, Biz marks the passage of time, and Theresa loves Jesse.
crosstalk
Biz and Theresa: Wooooo! [Biz laughs.]
biz
Guys? We’re both here. Before we get into how we’re doing, let us start—as we have been starting recently—by saying a big thank-you and we see you to everyone who is out there working because they are so needed during this pandemic. Everyone working in the medical field; everyone working in grocery stores and delivery and… y’know, warehouses. Where you’re packing stuff up and shipping things out. UPS! I mean, like, I love—not specifically UPS, but I mean, all delivery services! [Laughs.] It’s just—I really like my UPS lady. [Theresa laughs.] And—I do! And she’s lovely. She has two braids and she always gives the dog next door bones. Like, little treats. So he doesn’t kill her. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] So—big thank-you to everyone and to all of those people who are staying at home. I know. I’m getting itchy. [Laughs.] Soooo itchy! To get out. But! It’s really important that we stay home right now. So that… all of those people we just thanked can get out there and do their job, as well as to keep each other safe. Theresa? How are you?
theresa
It has been a rough day. I am not going to… start off… without saying that. Every single one of my kids has had a meltdown today? And… it’s… at least one, I guess I should say? So it’s just been… it’s been really hard. It’s been… not every day of this has been like this? But today was—so far—one of those days where… it just really felt… absurd. Like, it felt impossible today. So [though laughter] that’s where I’m at. [Biz laughs.] A little bit. I am really grateful to be here? [Laughs.] With you? [Biz laughs.] Um… and all of you listening. I’m really grateful for this community. Um, and I’m grateful for… my husband, Jesse. Who—coincidentally—has a birthday coming up this week. And he is currently driving— [Laughs.] Driving around in my minivan trying to get Curtis—our three-year-old—to take a nap, while our other kids are having iPad time in the car. We barely got everyone out the door and into the car. Just for the drive! Like, just for like a drive. Like… nothing special. Don’t even really need shoes ‘cause they’re not going anywhere. [Biz laughs.] It’s just been a really rough day. So… I’m really grateful for Jesse? I feel like our experience parenting has been… interesting? [Laughs.] And… [Biz laughs.] This time at home? During the safer-at-home orders? Has been like… everything we’ve learned how to do together? Times a thousand? Like, put to the test? Like, remember this scenario? Now you get to do it more! Remember this other scenario? Now you get to do it one after another with no break in-between! Like— [Biz laughs.] The other—you know what I’m saying? Like, the other night he was like—he was like, remember when weekends used to be hard? Because we’d have the kids all weekend? And I was like—yeah. And the worst part about that is I still think that sounds hard. Like, it’s not like— [Biz laughs.]
theresa
—my perception has like changed ‘cause we’ve gotten like so much better at it that now it’s like—oh, yeah, a weekend! I can do that in my sleep! No! Still a weekend—what?! A weekend?! With all the kids? Like, that’s still like—whoa. Like, heart palpitations a little bit. Like, that’s still a lot to like deal with. Despite the fact that it’s day-in and day-out and on top of everything else. And I was just thinking, also, how—just how… kind of funny our working relationship has become under stress? Because… like our working relationship— [Biz laughs.] —not our working relationship in the business—in MaxFun—but like our working relationship in the home is so funny right now. Because we’re both just trying to cope so badly. And like, be nice to each other but also we’re both kind of going a little bit insane? But like trying not to take it out [though laughter] on each other? And like we’re both just working all the time! Like we’re just working and working and working all the time. And… like, the other day he came home. He had—he had done his like once-a-week grocery shopping thing and he was putting stuff away in the kitchen and I was like, managing stuff going on with the kids and going in and out of the house with somebody who was outside and somebody who was inside and I was like cleaning up lunch dishes and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I went out to like take the trash out or something? And I came back in a few minutes later—no, I went to get something from the garage. I came back in a few minutes later, and [though laughter] there were all these beach towels all over the kitchen floor? [Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] And I said—and I could tell that they had been like mopping something up. And I said, did something bad happen? And he said yes. And then I went, okay. And then we just kept doing what we were doing? And I never followed up. Like, I never went back to be like—and he never—like, I never—it doesn’t matter. [Biz laughs.] The floor is a little sticky now a few days later. I haven’t gotten to mopping it. But it—and it’s like—he doesn’t feel bad that I didn’t follow up to ask. And I don’t feel bad that that happened. And it’s just… one of the—you know what I mean? Like, it’s just so—it’s so… that is not a normal… social interaction. [Biz laughs.]
theresa
Like, under normal circumstances it would be like—oh, what happened? Do you need some help? No. We’re past that. We are way past that.
biz
Oh yeah. No. The following—the follow-up question? For sure. I might be slightly ahead of Stefan. Stefan will be like—what was all that screaming about? It’s not important. I don’t—
crosstalk
Biz: I have zero— Theresa: It’s in the past now. Yeah.
biz
It’s in the past now and I don’t want to relive it.
theresa
No!
biz
Like, I don’t—
theresa
And why would you? It’s not gonna help to say all the stuff that happened! We don’t have any energy left to talk!
biz
No! No! Emotional development! The end! That’s what happened. That’s what that was about. [Laughs.]
theresa
The screaming was about some screaming.
biz
Yeah. It was about anything stupid these days. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
theresa
[Angsty noise] Oohhhh! Anyways. How are you, Biz?
biz
I—[makes exhausted, angsty sound.] Y’know, whatever, guys! Y’know, I’m here. Y’know. We’re all still in a house. I think… being home… this long… what lets me know how long we’ve been in and how long it’s been since I’ve really been out doing anything—it’s my—my hair. The roots of my hair are like the rings of an old tree. [Laughs.] It just—the roots of my hair are just marking the days. As they pass by. It’s like, oh! I can—I can see now. We’ve hit—we’re way past the thirty-day. Right? Like, it’s—the like—this just—the grey. The whites. [Laughs.] Here was a year. Here was a year in which things were very dry. [Laughs.] Like, right over here in my hair is where I took really good care of it for a while? [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] A lotta moisture at that point in time.
theresa
You were really into like vitamins for a few months and yeah.
biz
Yeah. I really—I—like was taking care of it. Now? [Theresa laughs.] You just old. You just old is what’s coming out now! This tree is slowly… dying. [Laughs.] And the only other time it’s been this… long was when I had Ellis. And like, it was probably a year and a half— [Laughs.] Before I did anything else. Which makes me feel like I know that’s not true? For everybody? A lot of people are very good at taking care of themselves? And I think that ties in nicely to what we’re gonna talk about today? Which is… Never Have I Ever!
music
Banjo strums; cheerful banjo music continues through dialogue.
theresa
Please—take a moment to remember: If you’re friends of the hosts of One Bad Mother, you should assume that when we talk about other moms, we’re talking about you.
biz
If you are married to the host of One Bad Mother, we definitely are talking about you.
theresa
Nothing we say constitutes professional parenting advice.
biz
Biz and Theresa’s children are brilliant, lovely, and exceedingly extraordinary.
theresa
Nothing said on this podcast about them implies otherwise. [Banjo music fades out.] [Biz and Theresa repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss the weekly topic.]
biz
Never have I ever… let the roots of my hair go so long, Theresa! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] That—that I could cut my hair and not have to worry about dyeing it again! Drink! [Laughs.] So—never have I ever… is this game that, uh, the college kids and the twenty-somethings play. We certainly don’t play it now as adults. And it’s the basic premise is—never have I ever—and then you say something that maybe you’ve done or maybe you wanna see if like friends have done? Right? And then if you have done it, you drink! So like… never have I ever… fallen into debt due to calling a phone psychic way too much! Drink! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] And I think we even toyed with this, like, before—like, early on. When we had… younger children. Different numbers of children and younger children. We definitely touched on the—never will I ever… let my kids have a tablet at a restaurant. Never will I ever… give my children non-organic food. Right? [Laughs.] Never will I ever give my children plastic toys! Right? Like… and just how quickly that… devolved. Right? Like, how quickly we suddenly found ourselves saying—why did I ever put a limit? [Laughs.] On how low I could go? [Laughs.] Right? Let’s talk about the things we wouldn’t have done otherwise? Whether that be good… or bad. [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah. This has been such an interesting thing to just like self-observe. Hasn’t it? Like—
biz
Yes!
theresa
Y’know? Like to kind of watch myself… making decisions that I wouldn’t have otherwise. [Biz laughs.] And like—and like kind of judge myself? Like— [Biz laughs.] This is cool! Like this is—like, this is cool! I don’t—like, I would like to think that I would’ve done this regardless? But I don’t think I would have. This is really cool. Or like, y’know, just like letting—playing imaginary games for like longer amounts of time or like going out… to… [Biz laughs.] Like, look for cool rocks in the yard for 45 minutes! [Biz laughs.] Like, just weird—y’know, just like… stuff that I just wouldn’t have had the tolerance for? But then also… just observing… like… the—the one that like bugs me the most? That somehow I’ve ended up doing… is like the three different kids on three different devices? At some point during the day? Which I… which bothers me. I’m—I think it’s for real reasons and not just like… self-judging reasons? Like, I just—I would rather them be watching something socially? And…
biz
Mmm. I see.
theresa
And also just for simplicity’s sake. Like, for me. [Biz laughs.] Like, to turn one thing on and off. But—
biz
[Through laughter] I really like—hold on. Just for clarity’s sake—you’re not saying I don’t want my [though laughter] kids on a screen. I just want ‘em to be on a screen together! [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah!
crosstalk
Biz: Yes. Theresa: Yeah!
theresa
That feels better to me. [Biz laughs.]
biz
Let me clarify why I asked that question. I just didn’t want anyone to think it sounded like—I don’t want my children on devices. [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah! No! Well, I mean—how would you even—okay.
crosstalk
Biz: You can’t. Theresa: I don’t even know—
theresa
—how I—yeah. I don’t…
biz
Yeah. You can’t.
theresa
So that’s— [Biz laughs.] —part of this. Like, I’m… that’s—that’s a separate episode, I think? I’m having such a hard time with the extent to which we’re using Zoom for absolutely everything? Like… and people are seemingly feeling fine suggesting it for more things. Like, oh, well we can—what if we do a Zoom thing? Like, let’s add Zoom stuff to our lives! Like, I’m—I’m dying. Of Zoom. [Biz laughs.] And— [Laughs.] And, uh, so that’s like a separate—that’s a separate thing. But like… just the—it’s—it’s like a—it’s like a visceral thing more than anything else? Is like, if my kids are all watching something together? I mean, obviously I still want there to be a limit on that, but like I feel like they can like bond over it or they could talk about it after when they turn it off, or—y’know, and it’s just like more of a social experience? And their faces are farther away from the screen. Like, they don’t get as absorbed in it? And it’s not as big of a transition to like come back out of it? But also… like, just— [Laughs.] See how—having them all set up on different devices? Which happens a lot right now because of the homeschooling stuff. Like, I’ll have to have somebody set up on something; somebody set up on something else; and then somebody—like, it’s just—and then what I find is… because of the ages that my kids are, and the fact that—aside from Grace—like, Oscar and Curtis don’t have as much experience? Like, with technology. And so a lot of it they can’t really maneuver themselves most of the time. And so I’m like hopping around in-between each kid— [Biz laughs.] —back and forth, like a complete idiot. Y’know? And it’s—it’s—it’s very frustrating and unpleasant? And there’s very little payoff for that. So— [Biz laughs.] But I still do it! Like, I still do it ‘cause I haven’t figured it—I haven’t figure out how not to during this time.
biz
Yeah. No. I’m 100% with you on… the device use. I’m pro-device. [Laughs.] Pro-TV. But because all the school stuff is on it now? It does make… the… screentime that we were already allowing feel like a lot? And I will say that when—in the realm of never would I ever or never have I ever? Uh, just given up that fight real quick. And just been like—yeah. Go for it. [Laughs.] Go—
theresa
Oh, totally.
biz
Yeah. Just go. Just fucking do it. You mentioned something earlier at the beginning—which I think is very funny because it speaks to… what each of us… find enjoyable? And don’t find enjoyable. Like, you’re like, y’know, I could sit and play a game for, y’know, much longer than I would normally! And I’m like, oh, god. If I could just… go out and look for rocks, man. Like, if everybody could stay focused on rocks. Right? But… for me, it’s been stuff like… I think for me, it was things that I thought… would work. In my brain. But like just as this was beginning? And now… a month into it, where we actually—like, where I actually stand on those things? [Laughs.] My example—one of my examples is… Katy Belle had this big weeklong school camping trip. That she had been like emotionally preparing for all year. It’s like, all the fifth and sixth graders go. It’s a huge deal. Very exciting. And obviously? That was cancelled. And she was really bummed out about it when, y’know, all these announcements came out a month ago that everything was being put on hold. And I said—we can—let’s do a campout in the backyard. Right? Now that… is logical. It even sounds like me. I’m very pro-backyard campout. We’ve never done it. We’ve never done it! But in my mind—
theresa
But you could! Yeah!
biz
Yeah! We’re camping people in my mind. [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah! Oh yeah. You have the tent!
biz
We have the tent.
theresa
That’s the main thing. [Laughs.]
biz
Uh, some of us—some of us have sleeping bags. Right? But either way—we have a fire pit. So we’re gonna have… some fun! Now, fast-forward a month later. Right? To… this past weekend. And the weather has been so hit-and-miss. Definitely was not warm or like clear this weekend. And we’ve already had to push the campout three days due to rain and things like that. And man oh man, I am so fucking touched out! I am so fucking tired. I am so fucking tired of people talking at me in loud voices. Voices that are so loud! So loud! And… the idea of getting into a tent? [Laughs.] With all that touching and voices? I just—I did—all I wanted to do was every time somebody said yay, it’s campout weekend! I just wanted to scream, nooooo! Like, at the top of my lungs. Noooo! I don’t wanna do—I mean, my inner toddler—I don’t wanna do this! This is not gonna be fun for me! I absolutely! Ugh! Like, it just… felt… impossible to do. And everybody else was up and like excited and I had to really push myself and rally. And we did it.
theresa
Whoa.
biz
But… oh no! Yeah. We did it. And there’s—ahhh.
theresa
But you did it for real? Did you sleep out there?
biz
No, of course we did! I—yes!
crosstalk
Biz: Because everybody wanted to do it. Theresa: You really did it. Okay. I wasn’t sure if you actually did it!
theresa
I wasn’t sure if you actually did. I wasn’t sure if…
biz
Nope. I know. I could’ve easily backed out or somebody else—I’m like, of all the times…
crosstalk
Biz: No one is wanting to back out. Theresa: ‘Cause it was cold, too!
biz
Yeah! I kept thinking—everybody go out and play and then they’ll just inevitably say it’s too cold to campout. But that didn’t happen. And then I thought—somebody’s gonna say this—like, somebody—Ellis is gonna be like, I wanna go inside. But he didn’t. Because… he was gonna get to sleep… cuddled up to me! So that’s exciting, even if we were just like in the middle of the street. [Laughs.]
crosstalk
Theresa: Right. Yeah. He would take his chances in the middle of the street. Yeah. Biz: [Inaudible.] Yeah. He’d take his chances in the middle of the street.
biz
Just so he could sleep next to me. We’re gonna be so old, I’m gonna be like—[imitating an aged voice] Ellis, come and brush my hair! [Theresa laughs.] Yes, mother! Yes, mother! Would you like French braids tonight, mother? Anyway. No. Everybody was into it. And so… I did it. And I was such a pill about it the next day ‘cause like Stefan’s like, this is gonna be real memories. And let me tell you—that is now the top of my “I don’t ever want anybody to fucking say that to me.” Like, think of the memories! It feels a little like the—“Time goes so fast! They’l be grown up!” I’m like… those memories were at the expense— [Laughs.] Of me getting a good night’s sleep.
theresa
Yeah. And your wellness. Yeah!
crosstalk
Biz: And my wellness. Like, my mental… wellness. [Laughs.] Theresa: Yep. I know. Your overall wellness. Yep!
theresa
No, that is so true. I mean, there is definitely… the—there is definitely… a… message… that’s circling around… that is like… just… think of it like you’re getting this time that you wouldn’t get otherwise. And—it really… it triggers me. I try not to use the word “trigger” like, lightly?
crosstalk
Biz: I know you don’t. Yeah. Theresa: But it triggers me!
theresa
Like, it’s not a good feeling to hear that. Because—yeah! I love my kids, too, and I love having good times with them, too. That is not what this is. [Laughs.] I’m sorry.
crosstalk
Biz and Theresa: It’s not.
biz
No, it’s not! And I don’t wanna dismiss—for those who are finding a great joy in this. Right? Everybody’s circumstances are different. Different aged kids. Different amount of kids. All that stuff. This does not negate that. But I’m with you. It’s very much that sort of line of… this is—think of the memories. Or think of all this extra time you’re getting that you wouldn’t have gotten otherwise. Feels very much in the—in the realm of… like… you should feel like shit ‘cause you’re not enjoying it hard enough.
theresa
Yeah! Yeah!
biz
You’re not enjoying it! You’re—y’know—
crosstalk
Biz: You’re—you walk! Yeah! Theresa: Good moms would be happy to have so much time!
biz
Good moms— [Laughs.]
theresa
Good moms would be happy to have so much time. Yeah. Yeah.
biz
That is good moms. God, that does make you just wanna— [Theresa laughs.] —jab it right in your eye! But that’s what this is. I think that actually ties in really well to what we’re talking about! This idea that… if this had not been the circumstances. If everything leading up the last… thirty and more days to this campout. I would have felt very differently about it. I would have been like—[singing] awesome! [Regular voice] Or there’s at least a stronger chance. That I would… have felt better about this. And… so it—it’s—it’s like the opposite—like, I’m not finding joy, actually, in the things that would’ve normally brought me—like, I’m not finding the “a-ha” moments of like… oh, actually it’s really tolerable to do a game go on forever. Right? Like, that would’ve normally have been really tolerable for me.
theresa
Right. This is not what we were thinking of. This is not that. This is… really not that. And this is—this— [Biz laughs.] Sorry. I just—this makes me think of, like, what you were saying as far as like… what—something you would have looked forward to under normal circumstances. And like I have found myself… in the mornings sometimes because I kind of like to move slowly in the mornings and I have a hard time… like… rushing around in the morning and getting everybody off to school under normal circumstances. And so one thing that has been really nice for me about this is that I have—we have, like, slower, calmer mornings. And recently I’ve found myself, like… when I’m up in the morning and I’m like thinking about how weird everything is and how weird it is that we have like a day at home—come—y’know, coming ahead. And trying to cope with that. I find myself thinking, like, well… y’know… at least you don’t have to like rush out in the morning. And like, if you had to, you wouldn’t want to right now. But like—you know what I’m saying? But like the reason for that is I don’t wanna do anything right now. Because I’m so fucking tired. And broken. That none of it sounds manageable to me. Going back to school doesn’t sound manageable! [Biz laughs.] Making lunches doesn’t sound manageable. Driving places doesn’t sound manageable. Doing this for any more days doesn’t sound manageable! None of the stuff sounds manageable because I’m too tired!
biz
Yeah. Did you— [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] Did you ever think—let’s just derail with this question. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] Did you ever think— [Laughs.] Did you ever think… you could get more tired. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] See, I think— [Laughs.] How many times on this show have we talked about, like… oh, there’s, like, infant to like—never being able to catch up with the rest you need? Every time you like get ahead, you’re still starting from five steps behind. Right? So… [Laughs.] So if we were already— [Theresa laughs.] Ten years behind. [Laughs.] When this started. Right? Like, for me it’s ten years. Like, eh, it’s ten years of always being several steps behind my rest. My best rest. [Laughs.] Yeah. I didn’t think I could… like, all the things I thought I had really like—like my patience was so… better. My— [Laughs.] My—my, like, going with the flow. My like, this is our structure and these are my boundaries. Like, I never thought I would go back against my boundaries. That’s for sure. ‘Cause I worked so hard. You know. Never have I ever just let all that go to shit. And just let Ellis crawl all over me while I’m eating food. Or… let Katy Belle, y’know, ask something and when I say no, argue with me and me not just say—no is no. Instead it becomes [exhausted, defeated groans] have a cookie. Like— [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah! Yeah! Seriously!
biz
It’s like, go ask your father. And like, those things… are… harder than—than the campout. For me. Because… there are… y’know… let’s throw out slippery slope. Y’know. How do… how do we come out of this on the other side? I mean, I—I have—I am in no place to start thinking about how that will work. Right? In terms of, like, as a parent. [Laughs.] And my relationship. I don’t know how we’ll go back to me, like, setting rules on food. And we—I haven’t let things go to complete shit here. But I’m tired because I’m trying to keep the few things that can stay… structure-wise—structured. But… y’know. The kids know that the dam is breaking and they’re just coming up and testing. Like, pulling sticks out. Left and right. And I—I just… I don’t know how that ties in to anything, but I felt like complaining about it. [Laughs.]
theresa
No. It—that is real—I think that—I think that ties in perfectly. Because what we’re talking about in our topic is—things being different. Like, last week we talked about this isn’t normal. Don’t pretend it’s normal. This week we’re talking about… this isn’t normal, and because it’s not normal we’re doing things differently than we sometimes would. And how do we deal with that? And what is that like for our kids? Like, I… I think my kids did… okay. With… being at home for the first few weeks. And they’re kind of… I don’t wanna say they’re starting to fall apart now? Because that makes it sound like now we just fall apart? And I would like to think this is like an important… moment for them? An adjustment moment where they’re realizing this is going on longer and this is funky and we’re trying to find our footing again in a new place?
biz
Yeah.
theresa
But that involves things being—acknowledging that things are really different and we don’t—we don’t know which rules we need to hang onto! Because they’re important.
biz
No. I—I think that’s… that’s right. I am with you. The kids starting to… feel it. I’ll say instead of saying “lose it.” Just “feel it.” You can see it like impacting… like, as they consciously… start trying to sort it out? But I… I think there are… like, the—the flip side of the things I’m—I’m letting them do… that I hadn’t been letting them do before this—or—or I didn’t find as easy to do. [Laughs.] Like, they are—I am never getting up to get a child a snack ever again. ‘K? I— [Laughs.] am never doing it again. [Laughs.] And that was something that was like, oh, it’s just so much easier if I go grab the snack for you. Or even if I’m already in the kitchen next to the snacks? I’m like, that is like a new—a new thing to emerge from this. Where is it? I don’t know. You’re gonna have to find—like, all the stuff that was very easy for me just to step in? And think—alright. They’re working on autonomy and independence in this area, but this one—whatever. Right? Like… this definitely has caused me to have to let go of some stuff I was probably over-controlling a little bit? [Laughs.] Probably. Like, that— [Theresa laughs.] —that I was definitely over-controlling? Um, that then, y’know, while it’s good it also makes me have the same thoughts as the campout. Right? It’s the like… okay. Why was I holding on to that so tight? And I don’t need a therapist to explain why I was holding on to that so tight. But it—it’s still… like… I didn’t think that would happen this way. Right? Like, I— [Laughs.] I think a lot of it was easier… to get the snack ‘cause I felt they were doing such hard work out in the world?
theresa
Yeah! Yes!
crosstalk
Theresa: I know what you mean. Biz: And now they’re not doing hard work?
biz
Out in the world? And so I’m like… well, we’re all home. And so now… you’re gonna have to, y’know, do those things that I know they require of you at school here.
theresa
Yeah. That’s really good. That’s a plus. I mean, I’m with you on that. I think there’s also that feeling of like I’m trying to preserve their good energy? Because of the next thing that’s coming up? And right now [though laughter] there is no next thing coming up so it’s a little bit like… if this goes off the grid or whatever, like… then we’ll just work on it until it gets better. Because there’s [though laughter] nowhere else to go. So that’s a positive. [Laughs.]
biz
That’s—that’s kind of still the problem. Even the positive things? That require the work. The work that is required from us?
theresa
Mm-hm. Yeah.
biz
Feels impossible when you’re so tired. And when you’re so… drained and when you’re snapping, like, so quickly. And like… I can either— [Laughs.] Like, exhaust myself running around and giving people the things that they are asking for, and I can also find it, like, exhausting to say—come get it yourself. Come get it yourself. Come get it—y’know what I mean? Like, it’s… at—both require work. And both are hard to do.
theresa
Yep.
biz
I will say that the plus side of all of these good and/or bad new choices that we are making is that there’s no one around to judge us. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] Yes, my children have a tablet at dinnertime but I’m not at a restaurant for you to see that! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
music
“Ones and Zeroes” by “Awesome.” Steady, driving electric guitar with drum and woodwinds. [Music fades out.]
music
Laid-back acoustic guitar plays in the background.
biz
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theresa
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biz
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theresa
Hey, you know what it’s time for! This week’s genius and fails! This is the part of the show where we share our genius moment of the week, as well as our failures, and feel better about ourselves by hearing yours. You can share some of your own by calling 206-350-9485. That’s 206-350-9485.
biz
Genius fail time, Theresa. Genius me!
clip
[Dramatic, swelling music in background.] Biz: Wow! Oh my God! Oh my God! I saw what you did! Oh my God! I’m paying attention! Wow! You, mom, are a genius. Oh my God, that’s fucking genius! [Biz and Theresa repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss their respective genius moments of the week.]
theresa
Okay. So… we’ve been working on the teeth-brushing and Curtis, my three-year-old, is very into brushing his own teeth. That’s very important to him. I… don’t think he can really do a good job of brushing his teeth? But again, it’s that, like, I’m not gonna fight this? Like I’m not gonna like tell you you can’t brush your teeth? Like, just—go—sure! Go ahead. Brush your teeth. But then I feel that I need to follow up? And I’ve found myself doing this thing that magically has been working? [Biz laughs.] Which is that I go—after he’s brushed his teeth—quote-unquote “brushed his teeth”—I go, okay! Let’s look and see how you did! [Gasping] They’re so white! Look at these beautiful clean teeth! And as I’m saying all these, like, absurd, like, over-the-top compliments? [Biz laughs.] I’m brushing his teeth!
biz
Oh yeah! [Laughs.]
theresa
I’m brushing his teeth while I’m saying all this stuff. So I’m like, okay! And let me look back here and—wow! You got back here really well! Let’s look up here! Oh my gosh, they are so strong and white and beautiful! You are doing such a great job! You are such a big kid! [Biz laughs.] And then I just rinse the toothbrush and I put it away. And… it’s great. Because… he really leaves—he’s—he’s so captivated by listening to all the compliments I’m giving him? That he just holds his mouth open for me. [Biz laughs.] While I brush all his teeth!
biz
Wow. Good job!
theresa
Thank you.
biz
That is a good job.
theresa
Thanks.
biz
So… I… wanted to do something—this is—and this is not necessarily recent? This is something that like pops up throughout this extended period of time at home? But old Biz—when she pops up— [Laughs.] From the ocean of the pandemic, is like—I’d like to make something nice for the neighborhood! Right? ‘Cause we have, y’know, everybody’s got like little things going on in the neighborhood like sometimes people are hiding like a bear in a window and you can go on a bear hunt. Like, for the kids who are all home? And so… there had been a project I had done for Valentine’s Day for the kids, where you take like a river rock and then you take some red paint and you thumbprint a heart. And then I turned those into funny little people! That said things like, I love you. So the kids and I sat around and we made funny little rocks out of our thumbprints on the rocks. And then later I went through and wrote things on ‘em, like, yeah! It’s really weird. [Laughs.] It’s okay! Right? Like—it’s alright if you’re feeling super sad right now. [Laughs.] Or—you’re not alone! Or, like, my latest one is like—a little heart holding hands with like a big weirdo? Like, a one-eyed weirdo? And it says—let’s just make friends with the weirdo. Right? Like— [Laughs.] And, uh, we put them out by the, uh, fence. The front gate. And Katy Belle made a sign that said, like, “Happiness Rocks! Take one if you need one. Take two if you need two.” And the project with the kids was fun but I have found that I really enjoy sitting there and like… fuck the fingerprints. I’m like, painting shit on there? And it’s not great—I am not an artist, but I am having the nicest time just like… painting. Drying. Drawing. And coming up with a funny thing to say. And I just have been filling that basket and people take ‘em! And then, as a really nice thing, we also have some signs up and stuff? But like, uh, two days ago—a fairy door magically appeared on our tree outside of our yard. Somebody had put a little fairy door and like a little fox and some little—it was really nice! And I was like—oh, I do really like the nice—the nice things that people are doing right now. That’s nice. I like… people. [Laughs.]
theresa
It is really nice. And it’s so impressive to me. It’s really, really nice. Good job, Biz.
crosstalk
Biz: Thank you. Theresa: That’s a nice thing that you’re doing—
theresa
—for yourself and your kids and your whole neighborhood. So that’s—
crosstalk
Theresa: —that’s pretty great. Biz: Thank you. I will say—
biz
—there are days where I’m getting the most out of it. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
theresa
That’s good. Good job.
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] This is a genius. I don’t know why I didn’t think of this before. My family doesn’t live anywhere near me, and so I have always had to rely on other folks, um, in my community to be my support system. Which is not working right now because of the order to distance yourself. But! I found two games that my parents and my brothers and sisters can play perfectly well, distance-wise, over even just a phone with my kids. So… my older child is playing Battleship a lot? With probably the game that my parents had from when we were kids. Battleship works perfectly well if each person has their own board! And then my younger child has been playing “Guess Who?” with my sister. It is great. “Guess Who?” is like the one with the faces but everybody has their own board! And it has taken… a big, y’know, sigh of relief that for me to be like, thank you, thank you so much for entertaining my children for an hour. Anyway. You’re doing a great job! Thanks. Bye.
biz
Good. Job.
theresa
This is so good. Yeah.
biz
Yeah. It really is. The Battleship—we’ve also done the Battleship? But like, with a friend. So like—the—but it—I was just like, [singing] ahhhh! So, yeah! I—but I never thought about the Guess Who?. The Guess Who? Is such a good idea too! You’re doing such a great job! And… I know you already know this? But this is also… not only helpful to you and your kids? But to your family. That they can’t be… with you right now, too. So I just—good job.
biz
Failures.
clip
[Dramatic orchestral music plays in the background.] Theresa: [In a voice akin to the Wicked Witch of the West] Fail. Fail. Fail. FAIL! [Timpani with foot pedal engaged for humorous effect.] Biz: [Calmly] You suck! [Biz and Theresa repeatedly affirm each other as they discuss their respective failures of the week.]
biz
Fail me, Theresa!
theresa
So— [sighs.] We had… [Biz laughs.] —made… rocket ships out of boxes. With Oscar and Curtis. I had made rocket ships out of boxes. One for each of them. Oscar had made one just spontaneously on his own and then I helped him like cut some arm and leg holes? And then Curtis saw that and wanted one for himself and so I had made one for him. This was like a few weeks ago. And then it was that thing where they were just lying around. And I—they—I was tripping over them and… it was raining so we couldn’t really keep them outside and I just—I threw them out! I threw them out. And… I didn’t ask them because I knew they would say no, don’t throw them out. And I decided I—this is worth throwing them out and this is worth—later—them being upset. Well. I don’t know—I don’t—I guess—I don’t even know that this is a fail? But it just fucking sucked? Because… it—like, a week later—like really a week. Like, it took them many days to notice that they were gone. To ask about them. And then when I said they were gone, the part that was a fail was like… how really sad they were? Like, that this was something they really loved and they were so betrayed? That I got rid of them? Without—like, it was like they had a real emotional attachment to these? And to be honest I kind of knew that? Like, this wasn’t just like a throwaway activity? It was kinda more than that? But I just couldn’t… I couldn’t keep tripping over the stupid boxes? Like, I didn’t have anywhere to put them! So I don’t know what I would’ve done differently? But it really sucked to start—and of course, they figured it out in the morning one day. Like, before a homeschooling day? And… I just sat there with them while they cried for a really long time and then one of them would stop crying and then they’d stop, and then one of them would start crying; the other one would start crying again. And it just dragged on and on and on. [Laughs.] That’s it. [Laughs.]
biz
I’m—I’m so… sorry.
theresa
Yeah. Thanks.
biz
Yeah. I—I mean, you’re right. I can’t identify the fail—like, again! If this was six months ago? We could laugh about, y’know, I knew it was coming and I’m gonna throw these away and they’re gonna yell! But now it’s just like… yeah. No. I don’t… I’m so sorry.
crosstalk
Theresa: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. It sucked. Biz: That’s really horrible. Yeah.
biz
One of the things that I had worked hard on [dramatically] in the time before the pandemic— [Theresa laughs.] Was—getting— [Laughs.] Ellis out of the den. Like, out of the den—living room—whatever the hell you wanna call it. He had had this Lego table set up. There were Legos on it. I just… like… we got a different table. All the Legos were in his room. There were maybe a handful in… the den that we were slowly starting to shift, right? Oh yeah, yeah. But he was getting more and more comfortable in his room. Doing his own thing. Not only is that gone—which is really kind of out of my control—but the den… is so fucking full of Legos.
theresa
Oh, yeah.
biz
Right now. They’re… they’re like… and because the house is full of people and animals 24 hours a day now? It—everything’s so dusty. And like… tumbleweed-y. And then there are just these Legos all throughout it. And I… hate it. I’m— [Laughs.] Like, honest to god I’m like, is there a place I can go in this house that doesn’t have somebody else’s stuff all over it? And the answer is—no.
theresa
No. [Biz laughs.] I’m so sorry. I—I… really deeply relate and I am so sorry. It’s funny, but it’s not.
crosstalk
Theresa: Again— Biz: It’s the same thing!
theresa
It would be funny for a little bit. But the thing is, we don’t—we’re out of our routine. Like, I keep having that thing where I’m like, well, I’ll get to it. I’ll—that day will come where I have time to kind of clean and catch up and like… organize or something. And the day never comes. And then there’s the realization that the day isn’t coming.
biz
Yeah. Yeah! I just try not to have realizations anymore. [Laughs.]
theresa
Yeah. [Laughs.] That’s good.
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] Hi, One Bad Mother! I’m calling with a fail, which at first I didn’t realize was a fail but now—now I realize it was a fail! Um, because I completely contradicted my amazing partner, who is home all day long with my two wonderful but very, um… overly energetic children? And stubborn and… gosh, what else are they? Hoo! They are some tough kids. [Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] Um—so—yesterday I got home from work. Yes, I um, I work in the healthcare industry so I actually still am going to work. Um… and… I get home, and my girls are sitting on my bed and they have set up, um, our little tablet that has a, um, a case on it. And they’ve set it up in such a way that it was plugged into the charger and it was kinda hooked over my dresser drawer? So they could actually sit and watch a show on the tablet! So here I am, just, like, praising them for—wow! That was really resourceful and that was really great! And… I’m impressed that you guys thought about that! [Laughs.] And came up with this great idea! So this morning, knowing that kind of the rule in our house is—if the tablet is charging, then we don’t watch it while it’s trying to charge. So this morning, the tablet was not charging—I mean, it was charged, um, but we just left it on the charger because one of my kiddos needs to have it working and not, y’know, battery dead for one of her online learning, um, things today. So I let them go ahead and set it up just like they had it when I got home yesterday, just thinking, y’know, proud of how… y’know, genius we all are. Um— [Biz laughs.] —so yesterday I coulda called this in as a genius. Today it’s a fresh hell because my wonderful husband—my partner—my life partner and the wonderful father of my children—um, came in and was just like—what is going on here? We don’t watch the—y’know, we don’t use the tablet when it’s charging! And I looked at him and I’m like, well, it’s not technically charging. It’s charged. We’re just making sure that it stays charged.
caller
And he looks at me like—okay, I really don’t think this is any different! And then I realized the error of my ways. That I have completely set a false precedence for my children— [Biz laughs.] —and have led them astray! And, um, have just made things harder for my husband and I’m very sorry, husband.
biz
First off—thank you. For your work. [Laughs.] We really… appreciate… that you are working as a member of the healthcare profession. Now. Let’s get to it. Yes! Youuu suck! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] This is such—this is such a classic—especially right now—moment? This is the—this is the—if you are in a partnered relationship? The off-balance of the—we all—all of us need something easier. And for one of us, it may be sticking to the rules that have already been set up. While to the other person, it’s tossing those rules out the window. And what is definitely—at least not happening in this house—is any pregame discussion. [Laughs.]
crosstalk
Theresa: Nope. When would you have it?! When would that happen? Yeah. Yes. Biz: What that—I know!
biz
When you’re in the middle of children screaming at you. Right? Uh, so like… I get how easy this fail was? To happen? I mean, god! We just spent the whole first half of the show talking about this. Definitely understand… but also—you’re failing every member of your family. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.]
music
“Mom Song” by Adira Amram. Mellow piano music with lyrics. You are the greatest mom I’ve ever known. I love you, I love you. When I have a problem, I call you on the phone. I love you, I love you. [Music fades out.]
promo
Music: “Baby You Change Your Mind” by Nouvellas. Rileigh Smirl: I'm Rileigh Smirl. Sydnee McElroy: I'm Sydnee McElroy. Teylor Smirl: And I'm Teylor Smirl. Sydnee: And together, we host a podcast called Still Buffering, where we answer questions like... Rileigh: Why should I not fall asleep first at a slumber party? Teylor: How do I be fleet? Sydnee: Is it okay to break up with someone using emojis? Teylor: And sometimes we talk about buuutts! Rileigh: Nooo, we don't! Nope! [Sydnee and Teylor laugh.] Sydnee: Find out the answers to these important questions and many more on Still Buffering, a sisters' guide to teens through the ages. Rileigh: I am a teenager. Sydnee & Teylor: And I... was... too. Teylor: Butts, butts, butts, butts butts! Rileigh: No... [Laughs.] Music: Baby, you change your mind Far too many times Over and over again Over and over again [Music fades out.]
promo
Music: Sophisticated electronic/string music. Travis McElroy: Hello, Internet! I'm your husband host, Travis McElroy. Teresa McElroy: And I'm your wife host, Teresa McElroy! Travis: And together we present Shmanners. Teresa: It's extraordinary etiquette— Travis: —for ordinary occasions! Teresa: We explain the historical significance of everyday etiquette topics, then answer your questions relating to modern life! Travis: So join us weekly on MaximumFun.org or wherever podcasts are found. Teresa: No RSVP required! Travis: Check out Shmanners! Teresa: Manners shmanners... get it? [Music fades out.]
biz
Well, Theresa. No guest today. Which is fine, because we had a lot to say to each other. [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] But you know who also has a lot to say? That’s a mom having a breakdown.
caller
[Answering machine beeps.] Hi, One Bad Mother! Uh, this is a rant. Or a breakdown or whatever have you. Short time ago—like, two days ago—it was official that school is closed for the year. And that’s fine. None of this is really affected me because my child has been at my stepmom’s since the schools closed, because my fiancé and I are both essential workers. And at first we were just gonna have them stay over there for like a week and enjoy being around my half-siblings who are much closer to his age than mine. And then… the shelter-in-place order went into effect and I—my fiancé and I decided it’s not safe to bring my kid home. He’s only seven. And we are out dealing with the public every single day. And… y’know, we just had this adoption get finalized? We were going to have a party. We can’t do that! And, y’know, it just sucks. I can’t even see my kid right now. [Voice starts trembling] And… I don’t know. I—I feel like such a bad mom because I also have just been enjoying not having him home. But I—I also want to see him! But it’s just not safe right now and it’s really hard! [Sighs.] This is all just… a lot! And then of course people are coming out when they don’t need to and they come in six times in a night and buy one or two things. People aren’t respecting this at all. Well, thanks for listening. You guys are doing a great job! And I hope I am, too. Bye.
biz
First of all, you’re doing a good job. Everything that you have shared just fits into the impossible-ness of this puzzle that we are all in the middle of right now! And I—like, all I hear, listening to your call? Are all of those voices that we talked about at the beginning? Like, in the topic about the like.. y’know, “It’s your time to be with your children!” [Laughs.] Right? Like—y’know—like, so when you say—there are times I’m enjoying not have—I 100% understand what you are saying. And I have zero judgment on that. I know for a fact you love your child and that you also want your child there, too. Right? I get it. That’s the mixed bag that is… honest parenting. Okay? Also, you and your partner—you and your fiancé—are making a really hard choice. No one—even with that said about, it’s nice having time away? From my child? That does not negate the hardness of the choice? To… not have your child home, out of fear of… exposing them to this virus. That comes with its own package of—of thoughts and concerns and… guilt and non-guilt and self-judg—y’know, I mean, that’s all… there. And then you add to that? Like… talk about things that are disappointing ‘cause we’re not getting to complete them or finish them or do them as we had scheduled. I’ve heard all about the weddings being postponed. Graduations. Adoptions? That’s really hard. ‘Cause I know how hard the process of adoption is, thanks to our wonderful listeners and our guests?
theresa
I also wanna recognize… that… like, the decision that you made to have your kid be at your stepmom’s was a plan that made sense to you in that moment. And I can hear you kind of second-guessing yourself, like, should I have done it that way? And now school is out for the year and… I didn’t mean for it to go this long and should I have done that differently? And it just feels like a good time to remember… what we’ve said a bunch of times on this show, but I still have trouble remembering myself. Which is—we make the best decisions that we can in the moment. And this pandemic is full of that type of shit. Like, there’s so many things about this that we didn’t predict, and we wouldn’t have known how to predict. And even right now! We’re making decisions every day that we can’t… predict the outcomes of and we don’t know if we’re doing the right thing. But we’re just using the best information that we have to make the decisions that we can right now. And in the future, I hope we will look back on right now and trust… that we were doing our best. And that… we had everybody—ourselves and our kids and our families and communities—best interests at heart when we made those decisions.
biz
Correct. I think that’s—and that’s really critical for… all of us. Is that last thought there, Theresa. This idea that… all the actions we’re taking—even when we doubt them?—I wanna look back— [Laughs.] On these times—no matter how confused I am about the choices and… y’know, the different feelings I have about all of it? That I was motivated by—and that we were all motivated by—trying to do what was best for our community and for each other. And those that we love. You’re doing a great job. You’re not alone. I know there are a lot of parents out there who are in similar… circumstances. And… to you, and to all of you—you are doing a good job. Theresa, what did we learn today? Well— [Laughs.] We learned that… everything’s different. And… not just what’s happening outside of our window, but what’s happening inside our house and how we are making decisions and how we are reacting to things. What I wanna learn from today? [Laughs.] As I, like, yell-scream at Theresa via FaceTime? [Laughs.] Is… what you just reminded us of. I can make choices today, and I can change those choices—or make a different choice—tomorrow. And it will be okay. [Laughs.] So… that’s… what I wanna take away? That and—I’ll never promise my children to go camping ever again. Oh! And by the way. You all know this is gonna turn into a weekend event. In this house.
theresa
Oh no!
biz
Just go ahead and predict that. [Laughs.] Everybody? You are doing… a really good job. It is incredibly… more right now. More… than… most of us have dealt with in a long time. Or ever. And… everything that—like we were saying at the beginning! Uh, did you ever think you could be more tired? Now I know that I could be more tired. Did you ever think you could set the bar lower? Oh yeah! Now I know I can! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] I know now! I didn’t know that this bar had a basement. Low, low, low, low, low! Everything is—like, just upside-down. And it’s very unsettling. And you’re all doing… a remarkable job… getting through it.
theresa
I just wanna add that… all of the… stuff we’re doing and the decisions we’re making and blah, blah, blah? It’s pretty miniscule, given the magnitude of all the stuff that is not in our control. So I think I—I know for me, especially, I have a tendency to try to control a lot of things and feel that the world is on my shoulders? And—what I’m trying to remember right now is—there is so little difference. I can make right now. Like, I wanna go back to like… I have the power to keep my kids home right now. I have the power to have regular handwashing and… y’know, wear masks if we have to go out. And all of that stuff. I have the power to, like, try to be nice to my family members. And like, try to be nice to the people online. That’s pretty much the extent of what’s in my control right now? [Laughs.] [Biz laughs.] And like, when we bring it back around to that? That feels more manageable to me? Than feeling like I need to somehow conquer this experience. Or achieve this experience. Somehow.
biz
Win the six variants! [Laughs.] [Theresa laughs.] God! Everybody? Let’s really all try to keep it a lot simpler if we can. [Laughs.] Thank goodness my bar is so low that “simple” becomes so very easy. Should I be thinking about—nope!
theresa
Nope! Don’t!
biz
Nope. I shouldn’t be thinking about that.
theresa
You shouldn’t! You shouldn’t.
biz
200 granola bars today? Well, look at you being independent and getting it for yourself!
theresa
Mm-hm.
biz
Good job!
theresa
Was it good? Was it yummy?
biz
Was it delicious?
theresa
Did you like that?
biz
How do you—how do you feel now? [Theresa laughs.] We’re just gonna Bread and Jam for Francis all over the place! Everybody—you are doing a remarkable job. And we… see you. Theresa? You’re doing… a very good job. And I’m sorry everybody was yelling today. [Laughs.]
theresa
Thanks, Biz. You’re also doing a very good job.
biz
Thank you. And we will talk to you guys… next week!
crosstalk
Biz and Theresa: Byeeeee!
music
“Mama Blues” by Cornbread Ted and the Butterbeans. Strumming acoustic guitar with harmonica and lyrics. I got the lowdown momma blues Got the the lowdown momma blues Gots the lowdown momma blues The lowdown momma blues. Gots the lowdown momma blues Got the lowdown momma blues You know that’s right. [Music fades somewhat, plays in background of dialogue.]
biz
We’d like to thank MaxFun; our producer, Hannah Smith; our husbands, Stefan Lawrence and Jesse Thorn; our perfect children, who provide us with inspiration to say all these horrible things; and of course, you, our listeners. To find out more about the songs you heard on today’s podcast and more about the show, please go to MaximumFun.org/onebadmother. For information about live shows, our book and press, please check out OneBadMotherPodcast.com.
theresa
One Bad Mother is a member of the Maximum Fun family of podcasts. To support the show go to MaximumFun.org/donate. [Music continues for a while before fading out.]
speaker 2
Comedy and culture.
speaker 3
Artist owned—
speaker 4
—Audience supported.
About the show
One Bad Mother is a comedy podcast hosted by Biz Ellis about motherhood and how unnatural it sometimes is. We aren’t all magical vessels!
Join us every week as we deal with the thrills and embarrassments of motherhood and strive for less judging and more laughing.
Call in your geniuses and fails: 206-350-9485. For booking and guest ideas, please email onebadmother@maximumfun.org. To keep up with One Bad Mother on social media, follow @onebadmothers on Twitter and Instagram.
Get in touch with the show
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@OneBadMothers
@onebadmothers
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