Transcript
music
“Crown Ones” off the album Stepfather by People Under the Stairs. [Music continues under the dialogue, then fades out.]
oliver wang
Hello! I’m Oliver Wang.
morgan rhodes
And I’m Morgan Rhodes. You’re listening to Heat Rocks. Last year, in anticipation of the Academy Awards, we created a new miniseries—Music and Popcorn—where we discussed people’s favorite soundtracks and movies about music. Today’s episode is for our 2021 Heat Rocks brain trust: myself, Oliver, and our guest co-host this year, Jocelyn Brown. Hey, JB.
jocelyn brown
Hello again! Happy to be here.
oliver
So, we batted around some ideas for this episode, and we settled on a topic that has come up with some frequency over the years here in Heat Rocks: nineties soundtracks.
music
“Trainspotting” from the album Trainspotting by Primal Scream. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
music
“I’ve Got a Love Jones for You” from the album Love Jones by Refugee Camp All-Stars. Love jones, I got a love jones I got a love jones for you [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
music
“How to Survive in South Central” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Ice Cube. Woman … your guide for South Central Los Angeles Ice Cube How to survive in South Central (what you do?) A place where busting a cap is fundamental No, you can't find the shit in a handbook Take a close look at a rap crook [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
I don’t know about how the two of you see this, but I feel like eighties soundtracks get all of the love and the attention and I mean no disrespect to the iconic films of John Hughes and everything else from the eighties, but that decade I don’t think has the monopoly on iconic, important soundtracks. And, as I’ll talk about more during my pick, I think the obvious thing that nineties soundtracks did was to bring in much more R&B and hip-hop into the movie game. You know, outside of a few key exceptions in the eighties, like Purple Rain or Krush Groove, a lot of the major eighties soundtracks that we tend to talk about were certainly not very heavily saturated with Black music at all—especially compared to what we saw in the 1970s, with all the influential Blacksploitation soundtracks, et cetera. The nineties, I think, finally brought some better balance with albums that were very important vehicles, as we’ll get into later on in our discussion today, for a new generation of R&B and hip-hop acts to get put on.
morgan
Indeed. I mean, R&B and hip-hop got married. You know, you had New Jack Swing and then, of course, hip-hop soul became a thing. Mary J Blige, What’s the 411?. [Oliver agrees.] What I always think about when I think about the nineties soundtracks is a lot of the conversation that I’ve seen on social media and have just had with some of my friends and colleagues, about how—for many of us—the soundtrack was better than the film. And so, we rushed out to get that soundtrack before we even thought about the film. Not in all cases, obviously. There are some exceptions. But when I—when I think about nineties soundtracks, the ones that stand out to me are Above the Rim. I think of Poetic Justice as being one of those. I think of New Jack City to start the decade, in ’91. And obviously Space Jam. So, some of those are stuck in my memory, but—to your point, it was R&B and hip-hop central. And those soundtracks were vital. We bumped those long after we had seen the movie and even if we didn’t go see the movie. [Oliver confirms.]
jocelyn
I’m with both of you. When I think about nineties soundtracks, I definitely think about the rise of R&B and hip-hop in popularity and seeing multiple genres within those worlds kind of fuse together. But mostly, I think about the fact of hip-hop and rap, by their nature, kind of speaking to a level of innovation and style, language and cultural omnipresence that kind of took over in the same way that punk music did in the seventies. [Oliver hums thoughtfully.] And later on, in the nineties, we kind of saw the same thing happen again relative to dance and electronic music. [Oliver confirms.] To me, it’s only natural that elements of both of those genres kind of showed themselves to be influential as well. When you think about punk and grunge, you think about the Singles soundtrack or the Judgement Night soundtrack. But as for me, today I’m gonna be discussing the first of the two Trainspotting soundtracks that were released during that era.
oliver
The way that we structured this is there’s three of us, so we each picked a nineties soundtrack that we wanted to talk about and we’re gonna go in the chronological order that they came out in. And so, that’s gonna mean that I get to start off first, ‘cause I chose a soundtrack from 1991—which was the OST, the Original Soundtrack for Boyz n the Hood
music
“Work It Out” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Monie Love. Time to work it out, you got the clout, the ability to achieve your every need so let me see You can do what you're doing now, I'll show you how Let me hear you shout--with Sister Monie we can work it out Work, work, work, work Work, work, work it out Work, work, work, work [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
The film may not have been about music, but there’s no way that you’re gonna set a film in early nineties southcentral Los Angeles, featuring Ice Cube as one of your leads and not have, I think, an ambitious soundtrack to go with it. And, in fact, I think one of the main reasons—actually, the main reason that I picked this is that, to me, Boys n the Hood produced the first good hip-hop soundtrack of the nineties. I don’t think it was the first-first, but if you compare it to what came before—and this goes back to a point that, Morgan, you were making. So, New Jack City, which also was from ’91—even though that—you would think that a film that is set during the rise of the crack wars in the eighties would have had, like, an incredible hip-hop soundtrack. Overwhelmingly, the soundtrack to New Jack City was mostly R&B music. [Morgan agrees.] And, you know, I’m not trying to diss Guy or Johnny Gill, but I don’t really think of them when I think of, again, eighties crack-era New York. The—to me, the only real hip-hop songs on that soundtrack were “New Jack Hustler” by Ice-T and “In the Dust” by 2 Live Crew. Which were both fine, but neither of them were particularly memorable songs by either artist. I don’t think they really rank super-high in either of their catalogues.
music
“New Jack Hustler” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Ice-T. I got nothing to lose, much to gain In my brain, I got a capitalist migraine I gotta get paid tonight, you motherfucking right Picking, my grip, check my bitch, keep my game tight So many hoes on my jock, think I'm a movie star Nineteen, I got a fifty-thousand-dollar car Go to school [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And then if you go back a year earlier, you do have House Party in 1990. And you got some Flava Flav on there. You have some LL Cool J. And of course, you have Kid ‘n Play.
music
“Fun House” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Kid ‘n Play. Smooth not slow, be a dynamo Kid 'n Play says so and yo Let's flip when the beat rips Wiz got a gift and we got the tune to shoot it Your place or mine? Anywhere's just fine And when you're in the mood to unwind and find a good time I'm looking for a great time [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
If you look at where hip-hop was at in 1989 and 1990, this soundtrack along with New Jack City, they feel like they’re cut from a different universe than one in which groups like N.W.A. or Ice Cube or De La Soul or Special Ed or Eric B. & Rakim. These are all the dominant acts, but they’re not represented in the soundtracks. And when you get to Boyz n the Hood, this—to me—is what felt like, “Okay, here is a proper, early nineties hip-hop soundtrack.” You got Cube on there, obviously. Compton’s Most Wanted. Yo-Yo. Chubb Rock. Main Source. Kam. Monie Love. And sure, a little Tevin Campbell and some Tony! Toni! Toné! for the R&B crowd. But I think the key difference with the Boyz n the Hood soundtrack is that it felt like it was put together by someone who was actually actively listening to what hip-hop of that era sounded like in comparison to some of the other films that we just—we just talked about.
music
“It’s Your Life” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Too $hort. Drive a brand-new Benz and they can't say shit It's your life, don't be stupid dope (Your funk is the best. Take-take my body and give it the mind) 'Cause when you waste it... It's your life, don't be stupid dope [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
As most people know if you’ve been listening to this show a time or two, I grew up in South Central Los Angeles. I saw this film in theaters when it came out. I saw this film in South Central. I think there were a lot of different sounds on here, but one thread was that they slipped in West Coast where it needed to be slipped in and I was excited about that. I was excited about Cube. I was excited about Tony! Toni! Toné! from the Bay. [Oliver agrees intermittently as Morgan continues.] I was excited about Too $hort from the Bay. So, I thought California was well represented and I loved, also, the dual score component of having two composers on there—Quincy Jones and Stanley Clarke. So, I thought it was a mixed bag of sounds, disparate sounds. But I like the angle that it took. It all added to—it all added a bit of irony, I think, to what was going on in the film.
music
“Setembro” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Quincy Jones. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
I’m curious, Morgan—not to turn you into the native informant here, but given that part of the film is shot in the Crenshaw, you grew up in the Crenshaw, how do—what was it—what was it like seeing this film and how do you feel like it represented the neighborhoods that you and your friends grew up in?
morgan
It was shot in—like, two blocks from where I grew up. [Oliver hums thoughtfully and agrees.] It was like a scene from my neighborhood. The train tracks the boys are walking on are a block and a half from my mother’s house. A couple of the liquor stores. So, it was like—that was what made it so real, seeing it in the theaters. In fact, my cousin was like, “Why did we pay for this? We could have just sat outside.” Right? [Oliver laughs.] But uuuh—but I think there was a little bit extra put on it. You know? There was a lot of conversation. It’s worth going back to watching the trailer for Boyz n the Hood—the voiceover is like, you know, “South Central, where crime and death—” And it’s like, pfft!
clip
Music: Slow, thumpy music. Narrator: In South Central L.A. Speaker: Yo, bonita, let’s do the loco thing. Narrator: It’s tough to beat the streets. It’s hard to be a saint in South Central LA. Furious Styles: I don’t understand why you insist on learning things the hard way, Tre, but you gonna learn.
morgan
[Oliver laughs.] The trailer is very dramatic. But it was very much a slice of, I think, my reality, in terms of what I was able to see. That’s what was so ironic about what was put on the soundtrack, that it did represent a lot of what I heard in the neighborhood, beyond just—beyond just rap.
oliver
Yeah. Jocelyn, how about you? Do you have any particular impressions about the music of Boyz n the Hood?
jocelyn
It just kind of sticks with you, especially after the first time that you see it—you know, I’ll say, Stanley Clarke’s name whenever that comes up throughout the film. You kind of find yourself on the edge of your seat because, like, there is some foreshadowing there, just in the notes that are being played from that sax and you’ve got that bass going and it’s like, “And what’s gonna happen? What’s about to happen?” And that—to this day—is one of the things that has kind of gotten me about that movie. I have to actively work to really keep myself focused on the film and what’s happening, because that track puts me in this headspace of being so concerned for the characters. And to me, when you’ve got a composer working the score and making the track on that level, they’re doing their job.
music
“Boys n the Hood Theme” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Stanley Clarke. Furious Styles: Why is that there’s a gun shop on almost every corner in this community? Why? They want us to kill ourselves. You go out to Beverly Hills, you don’t see that shit. Why— [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
We’re talking about the soundtrack. What’s the fire track? I hate asking this question ‘cause I hate putting you in the hotseat, but I know you’re gonna ask me, so all’s fair.
oliver
Yeah. [Laughs.] So, the fire track off the soundtrack—um. This was actually hard to pick, because—as I was saying earlier—this is a, I thought, a really, really solid album in terms of the quality of the songs. And unlike some of the other soundtracks I mentioned earlier that were basically I think repurposed songs that may have already been out there. They weren’t songs that were—that were exclusive to the soundtrack. I feel like for Boyz n the Hood, these songs were specifically solicited for the soundtrack, which I think also makes it special. So, you have things like there’s the remix to Main Source’s “Friendly Game of Baseball," which I—even now, it’s still a surprising inclusion, partly because it—he’s—Main Source is one of the very few East Coast artists to make it onto what is otherwise a very heavily West Coast album.
music
“Just a Friendly Game of Baseball (Remix)” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Main Source. So, the outfielder guns you down You're out, off to the dugout, underground I know a cop that's savage, his pockets stay green like cabbage 'Cause he has a good batting average No questions, just pulls out the flamer And his excuses get lamer [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Obviously, you have Ice Cube’s “How to Survive in South Central,” which I think plays during the closing credits. Pretty solid from him, though I wouldn’t say it’s one of his best songs. The track, though, that I was like, “You know what? This—this still holds up 30 years later.” Yo-Yo’s “Mama Don’t Take No Mess.”
music
“Mama Don’t Take No Mess” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Yo-Yo. Now when it came to partying, moms got wild Don't nothing get old but clothes, and they come back as styles (that's right, that's right) Yo, I got a down-ass mama Mama don't take no mess! [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
Yeeeees!
oliver
I stay stanning for Yo-Yo. [Morgan agrees.] I mean, her—all of her work from that era is—it holds up. Just go back to any of her albums from the early nineties.
morgan
Any!
oliver
That song in particular is crazy fierce and it may just be that I like any song that uses “Brick House,” but Yo-Yo just had—she had flow! And, you know, before there was “Afro Puffs” by The Lady of Rage. I mean, post-MC Lyte and Queen Latifah, I thought Yo-Yo really was just holding down L.A. and the west coast as an MC. And, you know, “Mama Don’t Take No Mess” is still just—it’s fire. It’s fire. So, that’s my—that’s my call. How about you, Morgan?
morgan
I’m stuck between two. I think just as a primer about South Central, “How to Survive in South Central”’s sick. And “More Bounce to the Ounce”—just, what do you—? [Chuckles.] [Oliver agrees.] [Stammering.] I mean, what are you—what—? [Oliver laughs.] That’s one of my favorite songs of all time! You know what I mean? So, that’s just chef’s kiss. And I think it’s the West Coast component to “Ten Crack Commandments.” It is sort of a primer in how to survive in certain elements, certain hood elements. So, it’s like a hood Thomas Guide. [Oliver laughs.]
music
“How to Survive in South Central” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Ice Cube. Rule number three: don't get caught up Cause niggas aren't doing anything that's thought up And they got a price On everything from dope to stolen merchandise Weed to sherm Cause South Central L.A. is one big germ Waiting for a brother like you to catch a disease [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
I also love “Setembro.” I loved Quincy Jones back on the block. [Oliver hums in agreement.] I love—I think it’s an interesting pairing between Take 6 and Sarah Vaughan, but yo! I mean, fantastic. And so, those two. You know. The soft side of me loves “Setembro.” The hard side of me loves “How to Survive in South Central.”
music
“Setembro” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Quincy Jones. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
JB. [Oliver affirms.]
jocelyn
Mine would be Tony! Toni! Toné!’s “Just Me and You.”
oliver
Aaaaah!
jocelyn
I’m a softie!
oliver
No, that’s a jam.
jocelyn
And I felt—it is! And I felt like it was impossible to escape that song during this time, at least on the radio. You know? As a group, they had a great run, around this time. And they had a really, honestly pleasing presence. I hate to say that. Like, this was—this was the one group that my mom and I unilaterally agreed upon. And I don’t know. Raphael Saadiq is just a treasure and so are the other gentlemen in the band. Like, that—that was my song.
music
“Me and You” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Tony! Toni! Toné!. I really, really love the way you're making me wait so long Now that the both of us really know each other It's time that we explored one another Don’t worry… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And if I’m not mistaken, I think that song—again, I think that was solicited. It was—it was recruit—whatever the right term here is, but it was made for the soundtrack and, unlike—I was saying before, some of these other songs by the artists that were on here may not necessarily be amongst their most, most memorable, but I actually think that “Me and You”—within the Tony! Toni! Toné! catalogue—really holds up really well. And if I’m not mistaken, is this—is this the song that plays during the sex scene?
jocelyn
[Chuckles.] It might be. [Oliver chuckles.]
morgan
Listen, I’m spiritual. So, if it did play during the sex scene…
jocelyn
Keep it spiritual.
morgan
You know what I’m saying? I don’t remember that. I blacked out. But no, I think it did. [Agrees with a laugh.] That’s what I heard.
oliver
I mean, the reason I was thinking about this is there’s not really—there’s surprisingly few musical placements. Or I should say, there’s few prominent musical placements in the film. And I think this is one of the few times where you hear something more than just—let’s say, just for a snippet of a scene. And so, maybe for that reason it also stands out to me, is ‘cause you actually got to hear like at least 60 seconds from it. [Morgan and Jocelyn chuckle.]
jocelyn
Keeping it spiritual. We’re gonna move on. [Oliver and Morgan agree.] Best music placement in the film. What do—what do you guys think?
oliver
Yeah, speaking of which—so, I mean, look. Like I said a moment ago, I think what’s wild is they have this incredible soundtrack and it’s not really a criticism, ‘cause I’m just—I’m glad the soundtrack exists. They don’t really use it that much in the film itself. I think the two examples that stand out to me, one is one of those aforementioned snippets and it’s the scene about maybe midway through the film where Tre is coming back from the barbeque at Doughboy’s house and he’s stopped in the streets by the bangers who, later on in the film, will kill Ricky. Spoiler alert. And in that scene, for—I don’t know—three-four bars, you hear the instrumental of Ice Cube’s “A Bird in the Hand." Which is just a sick, sick track. I think Sir Jinx put that together? [Morgan affirms.] But it’s short. And then it ends.
music
“A Bird in the Hand” from the album Death Certificate by Ice Cube. Now I pay taxes that you never give me back What about diapers, bottles, and Similac Do I have to sell me a whole lotta crack For decent shelter and clothes on my back? Or should I just wait for help from Bush Or Jesse Jackson, and Operation PUSH If you ask me… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And so, really the answer to this is almost kind of by default, besides the Tony! Toni! Toné! example. It’s when they play that very long montage at the end of the first act that’s set to the Five Stairsteps’ “O-o-h Child." And I could be wrong, but I’m—I’d wager this was probably the first time I ever heard “O-o-h Child." And so, it—I think it wins the category because of its prominence. ‘Cause it is the most prominent placement—one of, at least, of a handful in the film. But like I was saying a moment ago, honestly I think considering how good overall the soundtrack was, it seems like a pity that they didn’t use more of the songs in it within the film to more of an effect. Again, I’m not really complaining ‘cause I’m just glad the soundtrack exists. But it does surprise me that there wasn’t greater synergy in using placements from that soundtrack in the film itself. Feels like a missed opportunity.
music
“O-o-h Child” from the album Boyz n the Hood by The Five Stairsteps. Ooh child Things'll get brighter Ooh child Things are gonna get easier Ooh child Things'll get brighter [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Morgan, what do you think?
morgan
I don’t remember exactly the specific scene, but I remember the moment that I heard Newcleus “Jam on It," I was like, “Okay, this is fantastic.” [Oliver agrees intermittently as Morgan continues.] And I think it reminds me so much of Uncle Jamm’s Army and DJ General Lee and a lot of the things that—a lot of the music around, you know, sort of that electro hip-hop. Egyptian Lover. Africa Bambaataa. That whole, you know, mix of those sort of sounds. So, the moment that I heard that—which I think is from a car passing by—I was like, pfft!
oliver
Right. They get it.
music
“Jam On It” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Newcleus. (His speakers were three stories high, with woofers made of steel) (And when we brought our set outside, he said, "Hah, be for real!") He said, I'm faster than a speedin' bullet when I'm on the set I don't need no fans to cool my amps, I just use my super breath I could fly three times… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
You know, we’re gonna talk more about the Trainspotting soundtrack in a moment—which, you know, there was so much music that was used in the film, they had two different volumes. And I feel like maybe if Boyz n the Hood had had more of a—more budget backing for the music, they could have easily done all of the West Coast classics as Volume Two and had the Newcleus on it. Have Zapp, have—you know—George Clinton, P-Funk, whatever. That would have, I think, really made as a strong complement to all of the hip-hop that’s basically sampling from this stuff that you also hear in the film itself. Yeah.
jocelyn
Hearing “O-o-h Child” in this film got to me, for sure. There’s one other scene that really stood out to me where Furious is trying to explain gentrification and the drug war to Ricky and Tre and we see the other neighbors and the community come up and join the conversation. But all the while, undercutting that discussion, you’re hearing “Growin’ Up in the Hood” by Compton’s Most Wanted playing in the background. And it’s almost just too perfect. You know? Because it’s underscoring everything happening in that moment and the important discussion that needs to be had. [Morgan agrees.] I really love that moment. I really love that moment.
music
“Growin’ Up in the Hood” from the album Boyz n the Hood by Compton’s Most Wanted. Growing up in the hood, yea boy, 1984 Was the year my peers didn't know what was in store A little hard head kid came of age Time to pay my dues, learn the tricks of the trade And at home it's the same-ass story Mom's treatin' me like she don't even know me [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Next up, we have Jocelyn and her pick, which we’ve already spoiled it. And this is from 1996. It’s the Trainspotting soundtrack. So, why did you pick this one?
jocelyn
You know, I picked this particular soundtrack for a variety of reasons. A lot of things on this soundtrack were completely new to me. But there were definitely very familiar things there. Like, you’ve got New Order. You’ve got Lou Reed.
oliver
Iggy Pop.
jocelyn
Iggy Pop, in and of himself, was completely new to me. Never heard it before that moment. And, you know, you have this overlap of, like, all of the Britpop stuff that was going on and was pretty prominent. You know, throughout independent music or underground music at the time. But you also have the beginnings of electronica being introduced to the mainstream music world. When you’ve got Underworld on this particular soundtrack. It just kicked off a whole new world of musical exploration, for me.
oliver
And I’m curious, is this what you thought in terms of listening to the soundtrack as a soundtrack? Or when you were watching the film? Because a lot of these songs are very prominently placed in the film.
jocelyn
So, you both are gonna find this wild and likely controversial, given the topic of this particular episode and this series: I’ve never watched this movie in its entirety.
oliver
[In disbelief.] Whaaat?! [Laughs.]
jocelyn
I most certainly, though—I’m going to take a second to just say, I was 15 at the time and in a very rare instance of parental intervention, I wasn’t allowed to watch it at the time. And even though I’ve seen it up to a point in my adult life, I’m kind of too afraid to try to watch this movie in full right now, as strange as that sounds. It’s a little intense! It’s a little intense.
oliver
You make it—you make it sound like Hereditary or Insidious or something. I mean, provided like— [Jocelyn laughs.] It does—it ranks quite high in the pantheon of “heroin is bad” movies and it’s not quite at the level of Requiem for a Dream, but there’s certainly some very memorable scenes about why, you know, heroin bad. So. Yeah. Sure.
morgan
Well, two things about that. Oliver and I were not 15 when this came out. [Oliver laughs.] But we’re not gonna get into specifics on that situation. [Oliver agrees.] Right? But also, two: I think a lot of people—based on the trailer, I’ll say, skipped over this one. So, there’s no—there’s no judgment. Heat Rocks is a safe space for missing like, you know, critically acclaimed and wonderful movies like Trainspotting. No judgement. But there are a lot of people that I know that were just like, “This is too much for me.” Because there were graphic parts of it.
oliver
Well, what did you think of Trainspotting? What’d you think of the music in it, Morgan?
morgan
I couldn’t appreciate it as much then as I do now. [Oliver agrees.] Right? Now that I’m a music supervisor, I get it. I get how some things are on the nose but so perfectly on the nose that they’re on the money. And how other things are just so random but make perfect sense. I mean, Georges Bizet, “Carmen," “Habanera." What—what are you gonna do? And then the electronic stuff I think is important, but there—you’ve got—I mean, from Brian Eno to Lou Reed to a bunch of other things. At the time, I thought—I think—well, the first time I watched it, it was like, “This is so random.” Now, I know that it’s not. It’s just, to me—it just fits, in every scenario.
music
“Sing” from the album Trainspotting by Blue. So what's the worth In all of this What's the worth In all of this [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
My entire frame of reference for this movie is relative to the soundtrack and the music videos that accompanied it. And the thing that drew me into wanting to hear this soundtrack at the time was the way in which “Lust for Life” was utilized and presented at that time. And it happened a lot through the use of music bumpers and interstitials on MTV. And I kept hearing this crazy drum percussive pattern and I’d never heard anything that rambunctious before. Like, as a teenager already being rabid about music, I had to know what that was. And you—I later found it to be a recurring thing with tracks from this album. You would hear little snippets throughout MTV interstitials and show promos almost nonstop at that time. And that was how I was kind of starting to pay deeper attention to music and those little bits were catchy as hell. Knowing that there were also tracks that I liked from New Order, from Lou Reed, included. That made it just even more clear to me that I had to find it.
music
“Perfect Day” from the album Trainspotting by Lou Reed. You’re going to reap just what you sow [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
It’s funny, ‘cause when you mentioned that this was gonna be your pick, my initial thought was, “You know, I don’t really remember much about the music from the movie.” The things that immediately leapt to mind were specific scenes. And so, I mean, this won’t mean much to you, Jocelyn, as someone who hasn’t seen the film yet, but—you know, it’s the baby crawling on the ceiling scene. It’s Spud losing control of his bowels, you know, in the bedsheets. You know, that scene. Basically, as I was saying earlier, it’s—a lot of the most memorable scenes are all reminders that heroin is just—it’s bad. Don’t do it. [Morgan chuckles.] And so, really, “Lust for Life” was the only song that immediately came to mind. And until I went back to the track listing for the soundtrack and just was looking at the song titles and then it—I felt like it all came flooding back in terms of the use of music in like the club scene where Ewan McGregor’s character, Rent Boy, first meets Kelly Macdonald’s character. I think that’s when they’re using the New Order. And then we’ll talk more about this when we come back in the second half—
morgan
Oh, “Temptation."
oliver
Yeah. Yeah. “Temptation” by New Order. And then it—I just remembered, “Yeah, there was a ton of music in the film and really the film is inseparable from its use of music and the, in particular, the songs that play into it. So, you know, Jocelyn, even if you had never seen the film, it’s easy to imagine how the soundtrack by itself would be memorable. Because, I mean, that thing was really, really I think well put together. And, as we’ll talk more about, I think the integration between that music and in the film—and you’ll see this when you actually watch the film—was done really expertly. I think there’s a reason why, you know, Trainspotting is considered to be one of the best movie soundtracks of all time is for all of those reasons that we’re covering here.
music
“Temptation” from the album Trainspotting by New Order. Oooooh Oooooh Oooooh Each way I turn I know I'll always try [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
We’ll be back with more of our Music and Popcorn episode after a brief word from our sibling MaxFun podcasts. Keep it locked.
music
“Crown Ones” off the album Stepfather by People Under the Stairs.
promo
[Background music.] Will Campos: Since the dawn of time, screenwriters have taken months to craft their stories! But now, three Hollywood professionals shall attempt the impossible: break a story in one hour! [Music change.] Freddie Wong: That's right! Here on Story Break, I, Freddie Wong— Matt Arnold: —Matt Arnold— Will: —and Will Campos— Freddie: —the creators behind award-winning shows like Video Game High School— Matt: —have one hour to turn a humble idea into an awesome movie. Will: Now, an awesome movie starts with an awesome title. Matt: I chose The Billionaire's Marriage Valley. Freddie: [Stifling laughter] Mine was Christmas Pregnant Paradise. [Everyone laughs.] Matt: Okay, next we need a protagonist. Will: So, I've heard Wario best described as [laughing] Libertarian Mario. [Someone laughs.] Freddie: And of course, every great movie needs a stellar pitch. Will: In order to get to Heaven, sometimes you gotta raise a little hell. Freddie: Ha-ha, that's the tagline! [Someone laughs.] Check out Story Break every week on MaximumFun.org, or wherever you get your podcasts. [Music ends.]
promo
Music: Intense sci-fi music. Jordan Morris: Hey, I’m Jordan Morris, creator of the Max Fun scripted sci-fi comedy podcast Bubble. We just released a special episode of Bubble to celebrate the launch of our new graphic novel. At SF Sketchfest in 2019, we recorded a live show with Alison Becker, Eliza Skinner, Mike Mitchell, Cristela Alonzo, and special guests Jean Grae, Jonathan Coulton, Jesse Thorn, Nick Wiger, and a bunch of other cool folks. Speaker 1: We suspect he’ll show signs of mutation when in a state of excitement. Now, Annie matched with him on Tinder, so she’s gonna act as the honeypot. [The audience laughs at regular intervals.] Annie: I do enjoy being called a honeypot. Speaker 2: Hey. You know what’s better than honey? Gravy! Annie: [Gasps.] Ooh, yeah! Can I be the gravy sack?! Jordan: Out now on MaximumFun.org and wherever you get podcasts. And pick up the graphic novel at your local bookstore today. [Music ends.]
music
“Crown Ones” off the album Stepfather by People Under the Stairs.
morgan
Alright, and we’re back on Heat Rocks with the first episode of this year’s Music and Popcorn series.
oliver
So, Jocelyn, we’re talking about your pick, which is the 1996 soundtrack for Trainspotting. And I think you had something else you wanted to add.
jocelyn
I wanted to loop back around to the moment in Boyz n the Hood where you’re hearing Newcleus’s “Jam on It” being played. That was a song that I vividly recall from my roller rink days, and of course you heard Kraftwerk. You heard Egyptian Lover. You heard Paul Hardcastle. All of that stuff you would hear both in that space, you’d hear it in mixes on Black radio in the eighties, as well. And somehow the inclusion of Underworld’s “Born Slippy .NUXX” in this film soundtrack felt like a natural extension of that world, to me—in terms of my listening. It brought me back to something that was a part of my life very early on, but that I’d kind of forgotten about. And it put me back in the space of wanting to ask my uncle where his Kraftwerk records were, ‘cause I needed to hear that again. And it also just seemed like a very important part of the beginning of electronic music gaining a foothold in the mainstream of American listeners.
music
“Born Slippy .NUXX” from the album Trainspotting by Underworld. Hand girls boy And steel boy You had chemicals boy I've grown so close to you Boy, and you just groan, boy She said come over come over She smiled at you, boy [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue.]
jocelyn
You were hearing about Underworld. You were hearing about The Chemical Brothers and Faux Tattoo around this time. And MTV went as far as to create the show Amp, that featured electronic music from around the world. Because I was interested in it, I learned about artists like DJ Krush, Carl Craig, Goldie, and Coldcut on the show. This entire period of discovery, for me—you know, it ended up being one that changed my life, my entire trajectory. And all of that started with hearing this Underworld track on the soundtrack, first.
music
[Volume increases.] Hand girls boy And steel boy You had chemicals boy I've grown so close to you Boy, and you just groan, boy She said come over come over (come over) She smiled at you, boy [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
morgan
What’s your fire track from the album?
jocelyn
I think have tipped my hand earlier. “Born Slippy .NUXX” for all of the reasons that I mentioned before, but beyond this I would have to say Primal Scream’s “Trainspotting," because the loop that happens in the first minute of that track is begging to be sampled and used someplace.
music
“Trainspotting” from the album Trainspotting by Primal Scream. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue.]
jocelyn
And I found myself kind of head nodding throughout and, you know, recently listening to it again, dancing in the car.
music
[Volume increases.] [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
And if I can, I’d like to throw in a bonus track from the second Trainspotting soundtrack as well: Goldie’s “Inner City Life." That was a formative track for me, and it made me think about music very differently after I’d heard it. And the vocalist that you’ll hear on that track is a—is a woman named Diane Charlemagne, who I’d like to give her flowers. She was a member of 52nd Street and I love them very much. She’s no longer with us, but man, was she talented.
music
“Inner City Life” from the album T2 Trainspotting by Goldie. Living free [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Morgan, do you have a fire track off of Trainspotting?
morgan
Uh, my favorite—my fire track from theirs is Brian Eno, “Deep Blue Day." [Oliver hums in surprise.] That’s my fire track. And I’m surprised about that, because it’s Brian Eno and it’s super-mellow. But I think I can’t separate that track from the placement. And at the time, I was like, “Meh.” But going back and watching the film again, to me it stands apart. There’s some great stuff on there. But for me, I’m so wedded to that placement and how it’s used that that’s the fire track for me.
music
“Deep Blue Day” from the album Trainspotting by Brian Eno. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
As is my habit, I’m gonna go with the obvious, basic choice, which is—which is “Lust for Life." [Morgan laughs.] Because how can you go wrong with Iggy Pop?
morgan
Iggy Pop! Yeah.
oliver
With an assist from David fricking Bowie?! You know, cowriting that song. And, you know, it’s—again, spoiler alert for Jocelyn. It opened the film. So really, I think the Universal logo comes on or whatever—the film studio that put the film out. And then you get dropped immediately into the film, into the song, and—you know, I don’t really know a ton of Iggy Pop, but this is definitely—you know—a burner from him. I mean, this—it’s a Heat Rock from Iggy and it’s a great way to—again, the placement is great, but just by itself, “Lust for Life” is just so much energy, so much vivaciousness. You know. It’s great and, again, the obvious choice but I don’t think the wrong one.
music
“Lust for Life” from the album Trainspotting by Iggy Pop. I'm worth a million in prizes With my torture film Drive a G.T.O. Wear a uniform All on a government loan I'm worth a million… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And now we’ve started already talking a little bit about the music placements. Morgan, you had mentioned the Brian Eno one. And just mentioned a moment ago that “Lust for Life” opens the film, and it does so in this incredibly kinetic way, and I think it’s a wonderful way to begin the film. I think what edges it out for me, in terms of the placement, would be when Rent Boy is overdosing and there’s this long scene in which, as he’s potentially dying, we hear Lou Reed’s “Perfect Day” play. And whether that’s meant to be ironic or meant to be maybe non-ironic, either way—I mean, that’s a song that I’ve heard people describe as what heroin feels like. So, it seems maybe too pitch perfect? But you go back and you rewatch that scene and all the chaos around McGregor and the fact that he might be dying and that the people who have—who gave him the heroin are basically dropping him off very unceremoniously at a hospital. He’s on a gurney. And this song, this incredibly mellow—you know, it’s one of the most sublime Lou Reed songs out there is playing in the background. And just the juxtaposition between those things I think really, really makes this placement work. So. So, that’s my pick.
music
“Perfect Day” from the album Trainspotting by Lou Reed. Then later a movie, too And then home Oh, it's such a perfect day I'm glad I spent it with you [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And so, Morgan, yours would be the—you said the Brian Eno?
morgan
It is the Brian Eno track, “Deep Blue Day," because it is—it comes at a moment where Rent Boy loses his opium suppositories. He’s in the bathroom and they go into the toilet.
oliver
[Laughing.] It’s an amazing scene!
jocelyn
Oh no. Ooh noo.
oliver
You know, I gotta say, again, and I’m so—I’m sorry, Jocelyn. You just close your ears, ‘cause we’re just spoiling it. But I think the first time I saw the film—I mean, the film just opens with, you know, Rent Boy and his guys running away from the police. And so, already you’re kind of thrown into just this like, “What the hell is going on?” But until that scene, which comes—I think—really maybe in the first 10 to 15 minutes, where you see Ewan McGregor diving into—I mean, no pun intended, like, a shitty toilet. [Jocelyn laughs.] And it turns into this whole surreal thing. And again, the Eno music is playing in the background. I just remember thinking like, “What the F is this? Like, this film is off the chain.” And this is before the baby on the ceiling scene! It’s before like a lot of stuff.
morgan
It’s before.
oliver
Already, like in the first ten minutes. Like, damn. It’s funny. Our producer, Christian, has not seen this film, but he just put in the chat like, “This movie sounds insane.” My dude, you need to go see Trainspotting.
morgan
It iiiiis. [Laughs.]
oliver
[Chuckling.] You need to go treat—but just remember.
morgan
It iiiiis.
oliver
Just remember, heroin is bad.
morgan
It’s baaad! [Oliver agrees.] When this scene came on, I was like, “You know what? If I don’t take anything away from this film, heroin is bad."
oliver
Don’t do heroin. [Laughs.]
morgan
My man has dived into the toilet [chuckling] to chase his stash. But he emerges into this blue—I mean, so ethereal. [Oliver agrees.] And then you got Brian Eno. And for me, that—it’s perfect. So, yes. That’s my favorite placement.
music
“Deep Blue Day” from the album Trainspotting by Brian Eno. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
So, Morgan, you’re up and your pick is from 1997. What is it?
morgan
It is Love Jones. It’s the original soundtrack to Love Jones. [Jocelyn reacts with excitement.] And one of my favorites and music supervisors get asked this all the time. I’m sure Jocelyn, you’ve been asked a thousand times, like, "What are some of your favorite soundtracks?" This is in my top five. Not just because of the quality of the music, but neither you nor I would even have a job in this business had it not been for the trails blazed by the late, great Pilar McCurry, who was the music supervisor on this soundtrack. We lost her three years ago, but she’s the first Black woman music supervisor in the business. And so it’s precious to me for that reason. And also, too, because she was right at the cusp. She came right in at a perfect time of neo-soul, like she just capped it. And she put everything—she threw everything into this film. It’s so sexy. [Oliver hums in agreement.] And the scene is so sexy and beautiful and everyone’s beautiful in the film. [Oliver agrees.] So, this—for me—is just like—it’s a—to me, it’s an embarrassment of riches, sonically. Everything she had, she put into that. And I had a chance to talk to the director, Teddy Witcher, a couple years ago and he confessed that he didn’t really know about music budgets. So, he was like, “Oh, I just want, lik,e tons of Sade.” And I’m sure somebody was like, “Oh, no, no.” [Jocelyn and Oliver chuckle.] “No, no. We’re not—we don’t have that type of bread. In ’97? We don’t have that type of bread.” Uh, but, uh—but yeah.
oliver
But they got Fugees and Lauryn Hill on the cheap, because this was before they really had blown-blown up. So, you know, that— [Morgan and Jocelyn agree.] And that worked out for them pretty well, I would say.
morgan
It did. It did. So—so, yeah. It did undergird this whole neo-soul movement. And also, working around the spoken word scene, it was just like a perfect marriage. It was a perfect sound of spoken word at that time. [Oliver agrees.]
music
“Sumthin’ Sumthin’” from the album Love Jones by Maxwell. Even though you never wanna show affection (affection) I won't go, I'll always wanna show [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
This is my confession time. And in the same way in which Jocelyn has spent a lot of quality time with the Trainspotting soundtrack, but never saw the movie, I spent a lot of quality time with the Love Jones soundtrack, which I love. Have still yet to ever see the movie, though I did give it a speed watch so I could answer the music placement question. I will say, on that note, that—my god, like, young Larenz Tate and Nia Long look incredible together. We can—we can come back to that point later if we need to. But I just wanna ask you, Morgan—and you’ve actually alluded to this as we’ve been talking about it, but my memory of how people talked about Love Jones is they gave it a lot of credit for basically launching neo-soul. I don’t know if that’s overstated or not, but I figure you’re the person to ask about that.
morgan
It comes around the time—I mean, we’re coming around Baduizm. And so, I would take neo-soul a little bit further back. Right? I would say—I would take it back to D’Angelo. But I think this is—this is Baduizm. And so, this is where we’re getting into that—where most people credit neo-soul as having started then. So, I think—I think once you think about all that she’s got, all that Pilar put on this, all the artists that are just stars. They’re—Groove Theory is on here. Maxwell’s on here. “Sumthin’ Sumthin’." I mean, these are key hits for these artists. Right? [Oliver confirms.] You got the Fugees. You got Lauryn Hill and The Miseducation is barking. You know? You got Kenny Lattimore. So, I think this is sort of a neo-soul soundtrack.
oliver
Yeah. And I think also—and this ties it back into sort of also the—how the movie itself functions and the role that the music plays within it is… I’m trying to think; until that point, there was not as many—I can’t think of that many other prominent films that reflected the kind of—the Black bohemian side of things. I mean, everything that we got up to that point was more like Boyz n the Hood. They were hood films, basically. Right? I mean, you had a few things in there that were more about the—kind of the Black middle class. I’m kind of thinking of like The Wood, which is—you know, set in Inglewood. But I feel like Love Jones was the first one that was about like the spoken word café culture of—you know, a different—a different side of Black America, which I don’t think Hollywood had really done much of a job of showing. And Love Jones captured it. From, again, not having seen it, I can’t say this for a fact. But in terms of just what I remember of the discourse around the film is that it was one of the few things—first things that put, again, kind of like “Black bohos” to quote from I think what is Greg Tate or Nelson George’s term—really put them front and center, you know, in Hollywood.
morgan
A hundred percent. And I think it had to be so, because those two characters, Nia Long and Larenz Tate, they got the cool bohemian jobs, too. He’s a spoken word guy. She’s a photographer.
oliver
She’s a photographer, right.
morgan
Everything’s dimly lit. They’re fine. Lisa Nicole Carson is fine. [Oliver agrees.] You know, their friends are smart and everyone’s sexy. It’s lit really beautiful. Black people are looking beautiful on there. So, you could—you had to have a soundtrack that matched that, matched that level of sexy. And when you introduce things like vinyl—you know, Larenz Tate goes on to talk about how he prefers the crackle. You know. What’s so—you know, this is a music nerd’s thing and it probably bothered you too, but you know, his record wasn’t even in the case. I was like, “How’s your record not in the case?! You love the crackle! You ain’t even—but you haven’t protected your record!” Right? He comes in—
oliver
Well, no, but that’s why it crackles! Is because he hasn’t protected it! [Morgan laughs.] So, he’s actually—he’s keeping it mad real! Come on!
morgan
He’s like, “Yeah, you know.”
oliver
Let O-dog live.
morgan
I remember I watched it; I was like… [Jocelyn laughs.] But I just—you know. [Oliver laughs.] I loved him through it. I loved him through it. But uh—but there are so many good moments outside of the neo-soul soundtrack. [Oliver agrees intermittently as Morgan continues.] There are so many good moments. I love a film that has a record store in there. It’s just precious. You know what I mean? And they’ve got one. I think it’s called The Last of the Old Time Record Stores. And the classic scene is they’re playing Cameo’s “Shake Your Pants," which is one of the first 45s. Not the first, but one of the first 45s that I bought. And I was like, “[Clicks teeth.] This is key.” And they use it—Pilar uses it as score, because it carries over a couple scenes. And when it gets in there—when it gets there, it gets to that scene and it’s playing inside the record store, which I think is perfect.
music
“Shake Your Pants” from the album Love Jones by Cameo. I'd like it tonight 'Cause that's when my body feels just right Don't stop me, no, no Just watch me and I'll show you how Be a freak, feel the groove And we can move… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
Morgan, what would be your fire track from this soundtrack?
morgan
Ooh, tough crowd. That’s like picking a favorite child. You know? Uuuh. [Jocelyn giggles and “oooh”s.] There’s so much good stuff on there.
oliver
It really is. It’s so—it is such a good soundtrack. Yeah.
morgan
I mean, I will say this. I’ve said this before. I said this on another show, that there are certain moments that—as the supervisor—I am chasing. Right? [Oliver hums in agreement.] And I said that the intimacy that I think in some of these moments of Meshell Ndegeocello when she’s on records, those moments are what I’m chasing in supervision. And so, my fire track would be “Rush Over," Meshell Ndegeocello and Marcus Miller. I mean, it’s like a—it’s like a bass god summer camp. You got two of the best in the business on there, thumping away. Meshell doing her thing. You know, mix of sort of like spoken word herself and singing. I think it’s perfect. And it’s hard—that’s saying a lot, considering I love everything on there. But that’s my fire track from the soundtrack. “Rush Over."
music
“Rush Over” from the album Love Jones by Meshell Ndegeocello and Marcus Miller. If you feel the same for me, the way I feel for you I'll rush over Your music is so very beautiful [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
JB, how about you?
jocelyn
Mine would be Refugee All-Stars featuring Lauryn Hill, “The Sweetest Thing." [Oliver agrees.]
morgan
Mm. End credits!
jocelyn
End credits. But talk about a song that is evocative of a specific time, place, and mood, culturally speaking. [Oliver agrees.] You know, whenever I hear this song, I’m immediately transported back to kind of getting my first taste of freedom as a young person and just kind of observing how things work in the world for older people. I started college a little bit early and, you know, you’re on campus. You’re trying to figure out how things work and just chilling in the cut. [Oliver laughs.] But I would constantly hear this blasting out of so many cars on campus. I was at Florida A&M at the time, so you know, you’re walking along the set. You’re hearing people playing this from their radios and plenty of dudes trying to holler at girls who could not be bothered or care less. But things change. And as that summer moved along, you know, that was the only song that really seemed to fit what was going on.
music
“The Sweetest Thing” from the album Love Jones by Refugee Camp All-Stars & Lauryn Hill. It was the sweet, sweet, sweetest thing I’ve known It was the sweet, sweet… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
For me—and I talked about this song before, when we had Van Hunt on, because I realized, in prepping for that episode, that he co-wrote this song along with Dionne Farris, which is “Hopeless." Which is the first song you hear. It opens the film. I mean, the first time I ever heard this soundtrack—‘cause I wanna say this is the first song on the soundtrack in the same way that it opens the film. [Morgan confirms.] I was just instantly like, “What is this? Who is this? What does it mean to have a penny with a hole in it?” I don’t know if I fully understood the metaphor at the time, but nonetheless, it was such a pretty, pretty, beautiful, sublime tune that completely—I mean, we’re talking about this album almost 25 years later. This song still completely holds up.
music
“Hopeless” from the album Love Jones by Dionne Farris. I've stayed just a little too long Now it's time for me to move on They say I'm hopeless As a penny with a hole in it (Penny with a penny with a hole in it yeah) [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
So, I just wanna shout out Van Hunt again. I think I thanked him back then, when he was on the show, for having something to do with this song. I’m gonna thank him again and thank Dionne Farris for it, because “Hopeless” is it for me. Absolutely.
morgan
Ooh, that’s one fire. Fire, fire, fire.
oliver
I mean, it’s tough. This is a—this is a—I think all three of the soundtracks that we picked, and this is probably why we all picked them, is it’s not like they’re, you know, one- or two-trackers. Like the whole—each of these are just filled with gems. Let’s talk about the music placements in the—in the film itself. And Morgan, what was your favorite example? Was it—was it—was it the Last Poets-esque spoken word scene at the beginning of the film?
morgan
Uuuh, nooo. [Laughs.]
oliver
That’s not your jam?
morgan
[Laughing.] No. I would have to say end credits. I would have to say end credits. And I’ll say that because the scene in question—I mean, it ends with Nia Long standing in the rain. And I look back at that. I was like, “Why did she have to be in the rain? You know, her hair was done.” [Oliver laughs.] She’s standing in the rain. That’s how much you love someone—a Black woman standing in the rain, getting your hair done—getting your hair all wet. And they’ve gone through a whole lot. And it’s just so perfect, the way it comes up—the way the song begins. And it just ends on something that’s unfinished. She’s like, “I live in New York. How’s this gonna be?” He’s like, “All we have is right now.” And then you come into that—into the song. And it’s Lauryn Hill and it’s just so perfect. It’s just—it just ends just so—it just ends so perfectly.
music
“The Sweetest Thing” from the album Love Jones by Refugee Camp All-Stars & Lauryn Hill. Your kisses taste like amaretto Intoxicating, (intoxicating) oh, so intoxicating (intoxicating) [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Let me just, once again, say that I sped-watched this just to figure out where the placements were, and I saw enough of Love Jones to instantly commit myself to say, “I’m gonna go back and watch this properly.” Not tonight, but at some later point soon. Basically, around the time that Jocelyn and Christian watch Trainspotting, perhaps. But it’s the montage scene where they’re playing John Coltrane and Duke Ellington’s rendition of “In a Sentimental Mood." And I’ve talked about this song on the show before. It’s just one of—I think one of the greatest ballads of all time. The montage appears—which the song is placed, is I think around the end of the second act. And look, those two characters—right? Larenz Tate and Nia Long’s character could have been doing taxes and this song could have been playing and it would have been just as lovely, because it’s so—it’s so uber-romantic!
music
“In a Sentimental Mood” from the album Love Jones by Duke Ellington and John Coltrane. [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And I just want to acknowledge—and this goes back to a point that you were saying, Morgan, about how—you were a little annoyed at how Tate’s character handles his records. So, in this scene is—he basically says, “Hey, can I play you something?” And you see a record on the—on a turntable. And the needle comes over and it drops in on A1. And this is everything they get right in this scene—and not a lot of films do this. Number one, it’s the right album. Like, you can actually see the label. It’s John Coltrane and Duke Ellington. It’s an original or at least it’s an early sixties pressing, because you can tell from the Impulse label. I’m really exposing myself as a nerd—not that this would be a surprise to anyone in the audience. But these are the things that I notice. It’s like, “Okay, it’s the right Impulse design of the label.” And it drops on song A1, and then you hear “In a Sentimental Mood” playing, and so I instantly went and checked the track listing of that album and, indeed, “In a Sentimental Mood” is track A1. And a lot of films don’t get that right. Like, they just—they’ll just have a scene of you see the needle drop on the record. And it’s like, “Wait, that—you’re playing the last song, but it’s—the song you’re playing is actually in the middle.” Or something like that. And, to me, I think director and editors, pay attention to Love Jones and their use of “In a Sentimental Mood," because this is how you properly play a song off of a record in your movie.
morgan
Indeed! Shouts to Pilar McCurry, because that was her decision. That was her choice. I mean, such a massive, massive loss of a great, talented music supervisor. That’s one. And the other part is—I mean, for Larenz Tate, if you were gonna have all that, you needed to put your records in the case! [Oliver laughs.] If you were gonna be—if you were gonna be that discriminating about, you know, your songs, that stuff has to be preserved out there, man! [Oliver agrees several times.] You know? But yes. To your point, it is great. And when films don’t get it right with vinyl, I’m sure JB feels the same thing. You’re in there cringing like, “Come ooon!”
oliver
Jocelyn, how about you? What’s your favorite placement in Love Jones?
jocelyn
You know, my favorite scene in the film doesn’t involve a music placement, necessarily. But it does have to do with music and Morgan kind of alluded to this earlier. The fact that these characters actually walk into a physical record store, have an exchange with the clerk on duty—you know, you see Nina walk into the record store. She’s explaining—or exchanging pleasantries with the clerk and she tells her that she needs an Isley Brothers CD. [Morgan affirms.] And how many of us haven’t had that moment where, like, it has been a day. You just wanna hear what you need to hear in that moment. I felt that! And, you know, a very interesting exchange follows when Darius comes into the store at the same time that to me is pretty pivotal to this film. And necessary. And I appreciated it. So, that—to me—that scene in the film had a lot of importance.
morgan
Indeed. And it’s so nice to see—to have that moment with a record store clerk that’s not an [censored]. [Jocelyn agrees.] That’s really committed to helping you finding whatever it is that you need to find and they’re not Cusack in High Fidelity where it’s like, “Well, I’m too deep for you.” You know what I’m saying? [Jocelyn and Oliver laugh.] “Well, what do you mean? This is what you’re asking for, you don’t want this edition?” It’s just so nice to have someone be like, “Yeah. You know what? I got you.” So, that was what was also precious about that scene, that you got a record store clerk that’s approachable.
jocelyn
And that’s how you know you’re in the right store. [Oliver and Morgan agree.]
oliver
Have either of you ever been able to place music in a record store scene, in a television show or movie that you’ve worked on?
morgan
I’m working on something now where we will be—we will be doing that.
jocelyn
I have not yet been able to do that, but it’s a goal. [Oliver agrees.] And when I get my chance…
oliver
Bucket list right there.
music
“I Got a Love Jones for You” from the album Love Jones by Refugee Camp All-Stars Presents Melky and Day. Love jones, I got a love jones I got a love jones for you (Me and Mrs. Jones got a thing going on) Love jones, I got a love jones I got a love jones… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Before we jump out of here, as always we wanna leave you all with some recommendations. And we’ll stay on theme with our episode today about nineties soundtracks. So, what other nineties soundtracks should people check out? Morgan, why don’t you lead us off?
morgan
I’m gonna have to go with Death Row and Above the Rim, baby—1994, March 22nd. Why do I know that? [Chuckles.] Because I’ve played that thing to death. There are so many heaters on there. I mean—and I’ll just go down the list, although you should know—I mean, it’s just that prolific. “Part Time Lover," H-Town. One of my favorites. “Regulate” is on there, Nate Dogg, Warren G. The Lady of Rage, you mentioned it earlier, man. “Afro Puffs” is on there. You got Al B. Sure!, “I’m Still in Love with You." “Gonna Give it to You," which is probably one of my favorite cuts on there, which is Aaron Hall and Jewell—not to be confused for Jewel. And “Hoochies Need Love Too," “Big Pimpin’," and probably the standout track for me is an SWV track called “Anything." I don’t—
oliver
Oooh! Butter. Yeah.
morgan
Oooh, my god! That thing is fire.
music
“Anything” by SWV from the Above the Rim soundtrack. So long I’ve waited but it’s never too late for love It feels so right, baby, that it can’t be wrong [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
Jocelyn, how about you?
jocelyn
You know, I am going to do something a bit controversial. I love the Above the Rim soundtrack. I just have to stick that in there and say it. But I’m gonna do something controversial. I’ve got two picks in a dead tie, and my childhood best friend would be really, really angry with me if I didn’t at least say one of these things. Dead tie between the Clueless soundtrack and the Reality Bites soundtrack.
morgan
I’m not mad at that.
jocelyn
And, to my childhood best friend, Heather Grey, you know why Reality Bites is in there. Dinosaur Jr. will have its revenge on our friendship. [Morgan laughs.]
music
“Turnip Farm” by Dinosaur Jr. from the Reality Bites soundtrack. I needed to feel you there Oh, you’ll doubt it [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
jocelyn
Oliver, how about you?
oliver
I don’t have as many subliminals to be throwing out here. I’m gonna stick with my discussion around nineties hip-hop soundtracks and I’m gonna go back to something Morgan was saying earlier, about how a lot of these soundtracks completely outlived our memory of the movies themselves. Though this—in this case, this is another example of I knew the soundtrack well, I just never saw the film. Which was the 1996 film High School High, which I believe was a comedy that was very poorly reviewed. But in terms of hip-hop soundtracks in the nineties, this might have been the most powerhouse example. And they have—they have Wu-Tang on here, with “Wu-Wear." Not one of their better songs, to be quite honest. But again, they got the Wu on here. They have D’Angelo and Erykah Badu duetting on a cover of “Your Precious Love." They have Large Professor and Pete Rock putting together actually a pretty solid song by the two of them, called “The Rap World." Lil’ Kim’s “Queen Bitch” is on here. [Morgan confirms.] You have KRS-One doing a song called “High School Rock." A Tribe Called Quest have an exclusive song on here called “Peace, Prosperity, and Paper." The Artifacts with “The Ultimate." Sadat X and Grand Puba on a Brand Nubian reunion track called “The Next Spot." Scarface is on here. Inspectah Deck’s on here. The Roots are on here. So, I mean, this was—you know, I think really at the height in which music labels were like, “How—” De La. I forgot to mention De La was on here. They basically mined like, “Who are the biggest acts out there?” Especially for, you know, heads like myself at the time, in the mid-nineties. And so, when we just even saw the listing of the acts on here, I just remember like my jaw dropping. Like, “Wow. This looks amazing.” And it’s not like it’s a world-beater soundtrack, but I think as an artifact of the time and its attempt at capturing what hip-hop of—you know, of ’95, ’96 sounded like, I think High School High did a pretty impressive job in that respect. So, that’d be my pick.
music
“The Rap World” by Large Professor and Pete Rock from the High School High soundtrack. Large Professor Rhyme addict that gets dramatic When the beast is ill, you know the real really will C’mon kid, listen how we swing it like krill (In the world) We got drugs and crime (In the world) We got snitch dropping dime (In the world) We got money and clothes In the world… [Volume decreases and continues under the dialogue then fades out.]
oliver
And on that note! That’ll do it for this episode of Volume 2 of Music and Popcorn. [Theme music fades in.] Jocelyn, thank you so much for dropping in and joining us on this and thank you so much for being our guest host throughout this first half of 2021. It—we literally couldn’t be making this show without your contribution. [Morgan agrees.]
jocelyn
I’m honored—I’m honored to have been invited, and honestly you guys have made a very tough year so much better by inviting me on. So, I thank you.
music
“Crown Ones” off the album Stepfather by People Under the Stairs.
oliver
You’ve been listening to Heat Rocks with me, Oliver Wang, and Morgan Rhodes.
morgan
Our theme music is “Crown Ones” by Thes One of People Under the Stairs. Shout out to Thes for the hookup.
oliver
Heat Rocks is produced by myself and Morgan, alongside Christian Dueñas, who also edits, engineers, and does the booking for our shows.
morgan
Our senior producer is Laura Swisher, and our executive producer is Jesse Thorn.
oliver
We are part of the Maximum Fun family, taping every week live in their studios in the Westlake neighborhood of Los Angeles.
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Comedy and culture.
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Artist owned—
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—audience supported.
About the show
Hosted by Oliver Wang and Morgan Rhodes, every episode of Heat Rocks invites a special guest to talk about a heat rock – a hot album, a scorching record. These are in-depth conversations about the albums that shape our lives.
Our guests include musicians, writers, and scholars and though we don’t exclusively focus on any one genre, expect to hear about albums from the worlds of soul, hip-hop, funk, jazz, Latin, and more.
New episodes every Thursday on Apple Podcasts or whatever you get your podcasts.
Subscribe to our website updates for exclusive bonus content (including extra interview segments, mini-episodes, etc.)
Meanwhile, you can email us at heatrockspod@gmail.com or follow us on social media:
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