Transcript
sound effect
Three gavel bangs.
jean grae
Hello! And welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I’m guest bailiff Jean Grae sitting in for Jesse Thorn. This week, “Hearspray”. Kate and Richard bought their house a few years ago and have been spending a lot of time fixing it up. Kate believes that a paint sprayer will solve a lot of her problems. But Richard is concerned about adding that tool to their collection. Who’s right? Who’s [growling] wrrrrong? Only one can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the court room and presents an obscure cultural reference. [The squeak of chairs being pushed back followed by slow, heavy footsteps.]
john hodgman
What I do usually—I will say, “Look at that almighty paint. And look at that almighty brush.” And when I talk like that, automatically I boost my inside. When you sign that almighty painting, you hear the thunder in the sky. You hear the echo from mountain to mountain. You become the almighty creator. Next to God or whatever is you. Have that in your mind. Then, it is easy—very easy—to live! Yes, bailiff Jean Grae, hello. Please swear in the litigants.
jean
Okay. Kate and Richard, please rise and raise your right hands. [The squeak of chairs being pushed back.] Do you swear to tell the truth, the whooole truth, and nothing but the truth? Only the truth, nothing else but truth, just the truth? The truth is it. So help you God or whatever?
kate
I do.
richard
I do.
jean
Okay. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman’s ruling, despite the fact that it is the year 2024 and he’s been lying to us the whole time? [John snorts with suppressed laughter.]
kate
I do.
richard
I do.
jean
Alright. [Scoffs.] That’s your choice. Huh! Judge Hodgman, you may proceed.
john
I never thought I would get caught.
jean
Weeell…
john
But yes.
jean
Shouldn’t have asked me back.
john
I gave sleeping powder to the entire population of the world. Everyone slept for two years. And they woke up like it was a regular day.
jean
I’m refreshed!
john
And I said, “Guess what? It’s still 2022.” And they’re like, “Why is my lawn so weedy?” 2022. You know? That’s what it’s like. Kate and Richard, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment. [Chairs squeak.] You know what I was realizing? Here’s a good riddle. Kate and Richard, do you have—you’re partners in life, right? Cohabitants? Married, are you?
kate
We are not married.
john
Oh, okay, that’s fine. I don’t care anymore. [Kate laughs.] Do whatever you want.
kate
We don’t either. [Richard laughs.]
john
Right. Are there any kids in your life? Your children? Nephews, nieces? Uh, neighborhood kids?
kate
Kids in our life, not in our home.
john
Okay. Here’s a little riddle for them. What popular podcast is always listed on Apple Podcasts as not explicit and yet there is swearing on every episode? The Judge John Hodgman podcast. We swear— [Kate “ooh”s in recognition.] We swear you in! I never thought about that. [Jean “ooh”s too.]
kate
Well played, sir.
john
Alright, Kate and Richard. For an immediate summary judgment in one of yours’s favors, can either of you name the person I quoted as I entered the fake, internet court room. I see Richard is—you’re making some gestures. You’re touching your finger to your lips, Jeff Goldblum style. You’ve got some idea you want—please. What is your guess?
richard
[Chuckles.] Was that Bob Ross? Was that painter Bob Ross?
john
Putting Bob Ross into the guess book. Bob—how do you spell? B-O-B? [Richard laughs.] Okay, alright. Alright. And? Kate. Now it is your turn to guess.
kate
Well, I felt like it was like a motivational speaker, but I don’t actually know a real-life motivational speaker. So, I’m gonna say Matt Foley, motivational speaker.
john
Matt Foley. Who’s that? He’s a motivational speaker?
kate
He’s Chris Farley—“Van Down by the River”.
john
Oh, that’s that character. [Kate confirms and Jean laughs.] Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. I live in a van down by the river.
kate
Down by the river.
john
That’s a great one. And you didn’t wanna guess Bob Ross, Kate?
kate
No. You know, I’m not as—haven’t heard a lot of his speeches.
john
No. But you didn’t wanna guess any other television painters? Television painters? [Kate laughs.] Not people who paint televisions. People who paint on television.
kate
Are there other painting people on television?
john
Oh, are there? I don’t know! Are there? [They laugh.] Uuuh, was Bob Ross the only person to ever paint on television using, specifically, the wet-on-wet oil technique?
jean
It’s in that documentary.
john
Yeah, you know what I’m talking about. Right, Jean Grae? [Jean confirms.] Both guesses are wrong, by the way, Kate and Richard. But Richard, yours is the wrongest. [They laugh.] It was the wrongest of the two, because I was quoting Bill Alexander. You know Bill Alexander, Jean Grae? [Jean confirms.] He was the first one! The Magic of Oil Painting. Before Bob Ross, Bill Alexander was a German born immigrant to The United States via Canada, I believe. And he pioneered not only going on TV and doing a landscape in 30 minutes, but specifically using the wet-on-wet technique, which is using wet paint—mixing it on the canvas to create happy little trees. And indeed, happy little trees—he claims—is something that he coined that Bob Ross copied off of him. Now, originally—you know—Bill Alexander has a very expansive, inclusive world view. Has some wonderful, inspirational quotes. Initially, was very happy that Bob Ross—he taught Bob Ross! Literally taught him. Bob Ross was his student. He passed the paintbrush to Bob Ross on his—Bob Ross’s first episode of The Joy of Painting. And then, shortly after that, Bill Alexander realized that Bob Ross was a phenomenon. Bill Alexander continued to do his show, but basically, you know, got relegated to the sidelines. And there was some bitterness there. Kate and Richard, how are you? Thank you for being here on Judge John Hodgman. Thanks for your patience. Who brings this case before me for justice? Kate or Richard?
kate
I bring it to the court.
john
And you are Kate. [Kate confirms.] You are Kate. Okay.
kate
I’m Kate.
john
And tell me, what is at issue here?
kate
Uh, so, as the bailiff described, we bought a fixer several years ago. And I have suggested that we get a paint sprayer for efficiency and because it’s a useful tool and because I think I make reasonable decisions that make our life more efficient. And my wonderful, loving partner very strongly disagrees, feels that I am danger to myself and others should I have a paint sprayer.
john
Okay. Richard, you live in Portland, Oregon. Correct? [Richard confirms.] And tell us about this house and its condition.
richard
Well, now we’re happy with it. It’s [chuckling] not quite a finished home, but we live comfortably in it. When we bought it about four years ago, there were several serious problems with the house. And—
john
What kind of problems? Did it have a roof?
richard
Well. It did have a roof. We’ve replaced the roof since we’ve moved in, but it did have a functional roof at the time we moved in. Yes.
john
Mm. Mm. Okay. What were the problems, then? Oh! No walls! [Richard laughs.] Did I get it right?
richard
Well, um, [chuckling] there were definitely walls. And it was a livable home. It just had a lot of cosmetic issues. It needed a lot of updating. It needed—we replaced the windows. We’ve replaced a lot of the floors. We’ve done a lot of remodeling to it. It did have a decommissioned pool in the backyard that was mostly full of trash with a deck built over it. It had a detached garage that was—it wasn’t falling over, but it was leaning. It had—I mean, those are—it had several serious problems with it.
john
And I am looking at photos that you sent in that we will post on the show page at MaximumFun.org as well as our Instagram page, @JudgeJohnHodgman. And I see the photo of the—what do you call it?—decommissioned pool, what I would call the rubble pit that you had or maybe still have outside.
richard
Thankfully, the rubble pit is no more. It’s—
john
What?!
richard
Yes! It is gone.
john
[Chuckles.] Why? Why would you get rid of this rubble pit? Especially this photo of the rubble pit with a nice little side chair and a bottle of wine on it. That seems like a wonderful place to sit and relax on an evening. What did you do? Fill it in? What’d you fill it in with?
richard
Uh, mostly rubble. But we also removed about half of the rubble and then covered it with dirt. And I’ll be honest, just to have a dirt backyard was so refreshing after staring at that rubble pit for—I think a couple years. I think we had it for at least two years.
john
So, who was doing the work on this house?
richard
I think everyone. I mean, certainly Kate and I did a lot of work early on. We got a lot of help from family and friends. And we have, over the past four years, I would say slowly lost gas. [Chuckling.] Mostly any work being done at this point is by paid professionals, I would say. I don’t think we do much work anymore.
john
But you’re coming out of four years of doing a lot of the work yourself, fixing-upping on your own. Kate, what kind of stuff did you do to this house?
kate
Yeah, so, that pool—for example—we tried to take apart ourselves. So, first we removed the deck to then make it a rubble pit that we could throw even more trash into.
john
So, there was a deck over a sunken pool—concrete pool.
kate
That’s right. That’s right. To make it sellable.
john
And so, did you—how did you—how do you get rid of a hole in the ground?
kate
Yeah, so we started with a few work parties where our friends came over and we gave them alcohol and sledgehammers and said, “Go to it.” And so, we pulled about 16 tons of concrete out doing that, [chuckling] so that we could— [Jean and John give several “wooow”s.] Yeah. Our friends are wonderful. He says not 16 tons. Is that wrong?
richard
To clarify, I don’t think it was 16 tons. I think it was maybe two and a half. But—
kate
No! What?! Okay. Okay. Well, regardless.
john
Between 2 and 16 tons.
kate
[Laughing.] Somewhere between 2 and 16.
john
At a classic, Portland smash party. [Kate confirms.] Oh boy.
kate
So, we did that. There were bars on every single window. So, every single window, every single door had like steel bars over it. So, we cut those off. We—
john
How did you cut—what did you use to cut them off?
jean
Drunk strength of friends. Just ripped them right off. [Kate laughs.]
john
Yeah, exactly. Recreational THC-fueled superpowers.
kate
Yeah, it was like a tug of war—you know—field day.
john
No, but what kind of tool did you use, if I may ask?
kate
We use a metal grinder. So, it’s probably not what a professional would do, but it worked for us. So.
john
I have no idea what a—how I would start to do that. But you—did you go out and buy a metal grinder?
kate
We have a metal grinder.
john
Okay. You went to the hardware store and you’re like, “We don’t know what a professional will use to take off bars from windows and we don’t want your advice, either. Just give me a metal grinder.” [Kate agrees with a laugh.] “I’d like there to be mystery.”
kate
Yeah, yeah. We tried a Sawzall to start, actually, which did sort of work for some of them. But once we got to the ones that covered like sliding doors, we needed something more serious. And yeah—and right, who needs advice? [Chuckles.]
john
Let the record show that Kate is smiling very happily, and Richard looks very uncomfortable. [They chuckle.] This may be part of the dynamic. I just wanna back up for a second. You had a party in your garbage pool where you gave your friends a bunch of beer and sledgehammers?
kate
Yeah. And somebody brought a jack—like a handheld jackhammer that—Richard’s brother. Yeah.
john
Of course. That’s just something you have around. [Richard laughs.] How did someone not die at this party? Let me ask you a question, did you provide the eye covering?
kate
Yeah, so, we have complimentary personality traits. So, I provided the hammers and Rich provided the safety goggles.
richard
That is true.
john
So, some safety goggles at least. [Kate confirms.] Wow, that’s—that’s incredible. But I have to say, a demolition party would be a lot of fun. [Kate agrees.] It would be a lot of fun, and everyone’s nodding very vigorously now. I think we might—
jean
People pay to go to rooms to do that, to let off steam, to smash things and break things. Yeah. Absolutely.
john
Okay, so you did a lot of demo. Any other big projects?
kate
Yeah, so right before the pandemic started in the states—so, like early March, we demoed our whole dining room in order to finish our attic space. So, that was probably the biggest project that we hired somebody else to do. I guess I should say, we couldn’t quite finish the pool.
john
You didn’t just have your friends come by and give them a bunch of tequila?
kate
[Laughs.] Yeah, that one takes hard liquor, right?
john
Yeah. “Get this dining room out of here. Have fun. We’ll be back. We’re gonna go to the movies or the theatre or a restaurant, ‘cause there’s no pandemic yet.”
kate
[Laughs.] Yeah, so our house was in shambles right when we needed to stay home from work, when we were asked to stay home from work. Anyhow.
john
Got it. Oh, so, your house was a work site as the pandemic—just trying to get a sense of what kind of trauma Richard may have gone through in order to be so anti paint sprayer that he would take it to a podcast. Kate, why do you want a paint sprayer?
kate
Well, we’re coming down the home stretch on a lot of things. And I have done a lot of the painting. For example, in that attic space that we finished. And I think it would be far more efficient if we had a paint sprayer. I also feel like I would be able to do it better. So, faster. And then I would have more patience and gumption to do the like cutting in that takes more precision that I often run out of steam on. And then I will also say, the attic space—well, where Richard is sitting, as you can see nobody has cut in there, around him. So, it’s not finished paint.
john
Okay. What does “cutting in” mean, Jean? I don’t know.
jean
It’s all of these corners.
john
Getting those corners correctly?
jean
As a person who painted a four-story house and who made sure that everything was done with extreme precision, it is really the part where you kind of start to lose it. But you know, if it’s not done, you’re gonna see it across and stare it and it’s gonna drive you crazy. But it does take a hand.
john
I have an opportunity, using this teleconferencing tool that we use here for the Judge John Hodgman podcast—our proprietary teleconferencing program—to pin—what we call “stick pin” Richard, so I can make him reeeally big, so I can really get into those corners.
jean
Kate, how are you feeling about those corners right now?
kate
Oh, not great. So embarrassed.
jean
I know you are, ‘cause I have a lot of feelings.
john
I thought that you were using a virtual background, Richard. [They chuckle.] Like, you know how you can use a virtual background? I thought you were using a virtual background. Like, “Hey, look at me! I’m in a murder house.” [Richard laughs.] “Hey, look at me! I’m in an abandoned house.” ‘Cause those corners are sketchy. Let’s talk about the paint—these rooms that we’re seeing you in, I love the sea blue and I love the sea green. Nice colors. Seems to be well painted, at least in one of the rooms. These were not painted with a paint sprayer, correct? [Kate confirms.] Alright. Kate, I have another question for you about the paint sprayer. I understand what this thing is. Right? It’s a paint sprayer. You spray the paint. Right? It’s a thing that attaches to a hose and you just go pshh, fshh, fshh. Like that. Yeah. I’ve seen videos of these, and you have too obviously, or you—I mean, not only are you smiling and beaming—your smile just got a city block wide. [Kate laughs.] And you started batting your eyes.
kate
Oh no.
john
At the idea of a paint sprayer. ‘Cause it seems very satisfying, doesn’t it?
kate
Yeah! TikTok makes it look so easy. It takes like three seconds. [Jean hums thoughtfully.]
john
Oh boy. Oh boy! Right? Just fshh, fshh, fshh. So satisfying.
richard
I think part of the concern here is that once we have a sprayer, who knows what Kate will do with it.
kate
[In a muted, excited whisper.] Yes.
richard
So—but at this point, we don’t have any plans of painting furniture.
john
What else can she do except paint?
richard
[Stammering.] My view—my view is that if—
john
Wait a minute. Richard, Richard, Richard, Richard, Richard. It goes like this. Fshh. Fshh. Fshh. Isn’t that cool? [Kate laughs.] With the paint! It goes fshh, fshh, fshh.
jean
So fast!
john
You understand what we’re talking about here. What could be wrong with fshh, fshh, fshh? What could go wrong? Please, tell me.
richard
If something could go horribly wrong, Kate will find out. I think there’s a little bit more context to this dispute than I think Kate is letting on. This—I say this about my partner: she has excitability. She’s spontaneous. She’s adventurous. These are wonderful qualities. But I think everyone has, you know, some—
john
Qualities that make me very nervous and are not mine.
richard
Yeah! And so—well, and some blind spots! And I’m the more cautious one in the relationship. And there is absolutely a pattern, a history, here of some very rash behavior.
john
Establish the pattern. Establish the history. Be specific. Tell the story. This is your time.
richard
[Laughs.] There are really so many examples. So, let me just—let me start with just the painting examples. And this is probably I would say like five or six years ago I think was the first painting ordeal. My recollection is there was a small chip on the paint of our vehicle. Kate wisely, she got some touchup paint and got herself in a situation where she was trying to blend touch up paint.
john
And since you’re in Portland, by vehicle you mean your penny-farthing bicycle? [They laugh.]
richard
I would never let Kate touch up paint our bikes. We get our bikes professionally painted.
john
Okay, I got you. So, anyway, there was a chip on your car paint and Kate got touchup paint.
richard
Yeah. And it started out the size of maybe a dime. Probably smaller than that. And her idea was to blend the paint and—you know, if you’ve got the touchup paint, it’s never gonna blend. And pretty soon, it’s a softball-sized touchup paint spot that she’s got going on the car. [Kate giggles.]
john
It’s like that person who came into touch up that painting of Jesus in that Italian chapel and it turned into Cookie Monster or something.
jean
But I mean, what a—what a—what a gift! What a gift it was! [They laugh.]
john
It was an incredible thing for the world to have that! I mean, we’re richer for it.
jean
Thank you so much!
richard
You know, so Kate wisely actually she did solve this problem. Actually, she has this notion that nail polish remover solves everything. And actually, to her credit, it actually immediately removed the touchup paint. So, she poured it all over the car, which—as you can imagine—is a nerve-wracking experience in itself. But that actually solved the problem, no harm there. But an indicator of this proclivity that she has of maybe being a bit too rash with—and these are just paint stories. There are a whole different set of stories involving any sort of power tool. But this not the only paint story. There was another situation—this was the house that we lived in right before we purchased this house. It was a rental. And she was in the kitchen with fabric spray paint. And I believe she was spray painting t-shirts. And I believe she put them on the counter. She may have put them on some cardboard. There was certainly no like protective material around this project. I think it was just shirts on cardboard. And sure enough, a hefty quantity of this paint gets on our linoleum floor. And I didn’t really see how this unfolded. This was told to me after the fact. What I remember is walking into our kitchen and seeing Kate on the floor with a huge spot of paint. And she had figured that nail polish remover has solved the past, surely that was the solution here. And she had spread nail polish remover all over the floor, huge black spots everywhere of this fabric paint. And that one, I did solve. We just like poured soap on it, and it came off. But in my view, second crisis averted, but clearly a pattern. Those are the only paint stories that come to mind, but I—there are definitely other scenarios.
john
I’ll take one non-paint story, but house repair related if you don’t mind.
richard
Yeah. So, multiple house repair stories. And certainly, situations where life and limb were in jeopardy. But the one that comes to mind—we had a power washer for our driveway, which is great. I mean, that’s—and I will say, that’s another tool that we have had a dispute over. My view is, given your nature, given our lack of need for it, we don’t need to purchase a power washer. But we rented a power washer. We did clean the driveway, and Kate did not stop with the driveway. She went—[chuckling] there’s a portion of our house that has brick on the side of it. She started washing the brick, which sounds like a good idea, but not when there’s like little mortar pieces flying out—which she realized after the fact. She then went to porch and removed like a layer of the porch—which is still gone. We still have—there’s a huge spot.
john
A layer of the porch was power washed away?
richard
Yes! They—
jean
A very strong power washer. Or a very weak porch!
richard
[Laughs.] Probably both.
john
Why do you have such a weak porch, you guys? [Jean agrees and they laugh.]
richard
Well, I mean, it was—I mean, you know, we’re living in a house that—you know, was potentially—you know, sensitive.
john
Oh, is it—do you live in a candy house? [They laugh.] Is your porch made of meringue?
jean
Not a sensitive, meringue porch. Don’t power wash that. You can’t.
john
Coming up on HGTV, the new show.
jean
Sensitive Meringue Porches.
john
Candy Houses. [They laugh.] You know what I like about a power washer, Richard?
richard
What’s that?
john
It’s goes fshh, fshh, fshh, but like stronger.
jean
You know what I like about power washer? Everything.
john
It’s great.
jean
[Whispering.] So satisfying.
sound effect
Three gavel bangs repeated twice.
john
Kate, I see you nodding happily along to all of this. Do you acknowledge that you, perhaps, went a little far with the power washer? Sort of what Richard is saying, that you kind of leapt into some DIY projects that got a little out of hand, couldn’t be cleaned entirely up with nail polish remover. And also, is the way you get your friends to do all these chores—‘cause I hear nail polish solves everything—do you get them to huff acetone before they start working? [They laugh.] Is that part of the—part of the deal? Like, “Yeah! I’ll buy you a pizza and just smell this bag and get to work.”
kate
Psilocybin is legal in Oregon, now.
john
Wow, okay! [They laugh.] I’m coming to the—you know what? I’m signing up for this party. I’m gonna—I wanna come to the fshh, fshh, fshh party.
kate
Yeah! Everyone does. No, I don’t deny that I am—I think Richard described me as excitable. I don’t—and rash. I don’t deny that. I would argue I have not made any catastrophic mistakes. We’re all still here and healthy.
john
That’s a pretty low bar. [Kate laughs and struggles for words.] Do you know what I mean? That’s such a low bar.
jean
I don’t know. When it comes to house fixing up and DIYs and doing things—like, failure’s not an—it’s gonna happen. And I think it’s the only way you learn. But I also think if no one gets hurt, like if the acetone hasn’t burnt off an eye or such, like you’re doing okay! You can get another porch if your porch is made out of meringue. You know? No one getting hurt is a very big deal in fixing up in your house. [John agrees.] And failing.
kate
I do feel like we’ve failed—I mean, there’s—I’ve learned a lot. I—
john
But she’s not saying—but she’s not saying like no one got hurt or no one was permanently disfigured. She’s saying neither of us died. [Kate laughs.] Like, neither of us are dead. [Jean agrees.] Yeah, I would make that part of the mission. Definitely a top part of the mission of renovation. Like, let’s not kill each other. But go on!
kate
Well, I guess to Jean’s point, I do feel like we’ve learned a lot. So, I learned about the power washing thing. And without ruining our house completely. Though I will admit—you know, I didn’t think about that porch one. The porch one is a very good example of like it is still there, looking at us, and it looks terrible. It looks genuinely wretched. But I will say, we painted over it, and it would’ve gone a lot faster if I had a paint sprayer. So.
john
Yeah. How did you paint over it? Like this? [Makes teasing noises while pantomiming normal painting.]
jean
Yeah, like a dumb-dumb! You know, just with a roller. [They laugh.]
john
Wonk, wonk, wonk. Yeah.
richard
Judge, can I make a point of clarification?
john
Please. I’ll allow it.
richard
A point of clarification. Actually, professionals painted over the paint. We did hire professionals and they probably did use a paint sprayer. But that was not a problem solved by Kate or myself.
john
I thought we all agreed to tell the truth in this podcast, Kate? [Everyone laughs.]
kate
I forgot! That’s right!
john
We all agreed to tell the truth. How come your recollection’s a little hazy? Too much nail polish removerrrr?
kate
[Laughs.] Well, I’m doing so many projects, Judge. You know? I mean, I’m the one who’s—I’m the engine behind all of this work at the house. And so—
john
Is that true? Is that true, Richard? Is Kate the engine?
richard
Uh, [laughs] I strongly dispute that. I think that’s—[laughing] I think that’s, uh, a larger dispute than perhaps we have signed up for.
john
I’ll allow it, however! I’ll allow it. [They laugh.]
richard
No, I mean, we have both—we’ve both done a tremendous amount of work on this—on the house. I mean, I would say at this point, neither one of us is the engine. It’s all—it’s all folks who we’re hiring to do the work, at this point. [Chuckling.] I wouldn’t say either of us are—
john
That’s not—the person doing the work is not necessarily the engine. [Jean hums thoughtfully and Richard concedes.] You know. The person doing the work is not necessarily the engine. The engine is the person who makes all the other parts go and makes it happen. And then the person who is not the engine might be the person who’s like, “I really wish nothing would happen, because it’s disruptive and loud and nervous-making.” [Jean chuckles.] So, that would be—in this situation—the Richard, I would think. [They laugh.] There’s the engine and there’s the Richard. I mean, there’s—in my relationship, there is the engine and then there is the John Hodgman. Things get done. Things transition from nothing happening to something happening, particularly when it comes to changes to the physical place we’re living, because of someone else in our house who is not me. Would you say that that is accurate, Richard? Or am I mischaracterizing?
richard
I don’t think that’s quite right. I mean, I think I’m definitely the more conservative and cautious one. And I don’t wanna discredit—I mean, Kate has—Kate has absolutely been the engine at various points and definitely has a lot of energy to get things moving.
john
Oh! That’s a change of tune right there. Boy, oh boy! [They laugh.] I thought we all agreed to not lie! So, you said she’s not the engine and now you say she is the engine. Interesting! Which is true, sir? Which is true? I ask you, which is true?
richard
[Laughing.] My view is that, at this point, we are both pretty weak engines when it comes to the house. We’re still getting things moving, but neither one of us has a lot of energy.
john
The engine is rundown.
richard
That’s probably true.
john
Do you, Richard—do you or do you not, as a couple, own a nail gun?
richard
[Laughs.] We do. And I—so, I should say, originally it was a trifecta. It was the power washer. It was the nail gun. And it was the paint sprayer. Those were the three that concerned me most. And they were off-limits. And I did relent. I got the nail gun and we do own a nail gun. That is true.
john
I’m going to ask the question that never needs to be asked. What made you nervous about a nail gun? What could go wrong with a nail gun, Richard? From your point of view.
richard
Is that rhetorical or is that a genuine question?
john
I’m helping you out. [Richard laughs.] I mean, a fshh, fshh, fshh, fshh, fshh, fshh. That’s very different than a [mimicking a nail gun] CHTUNK, CHTUNK, CHTUNK with nails.
richard
Well, and I will say, the readiness with which she was willing to purchase this nail gun and the solutions that she believed a nail gun would provide us definitely added to my concern. ‘Cause my reaction was, “Yeah, a nail gun is super useful for these sorts of projects, but it’s shooting—you know—metal projectiles that could injure people.” [John agrees with a chuckle.] And could be used for a lot of purposes probably beyond what it was designed for. So, Kate was—Kate did not have a second thought about that is absolutely something we should have in our home, and I should be using it regularly.
john
I gotta be honest, Kate, what’d you want that nail gun for? ‘Cause that’s for construction. That’s not for cleaning up. That’s not for—you know what I mean? Like, that’s for putting up drywall and stuff, I think.
kate
All things that we are doing! You know? Putting up drywall and like putting in baseboard and—yeah! [John concedes.]
jean
I think I’m both a combination of Kate’s want to do things efficiently and Richard’s trepidation at high powered tools. So, I want things to be done quickly and efficiently, but I know that my fear of—anything can happen with a nail gun. Anything. Or I’m just like, “What happened?! This is just how I pictured it.” And then being like, “What?! What?! What?” In my hand. Any—just—anything could happen. But the amount of time that it took to build things without said nail gun or take out baseboards and put in new baseboards. It was just horrific! And I wish that I could’ve seen past my own fears and just had more time to spend with my loved ones. [They laugh.]
john
Is this timesaving for you, Kate? Or is this like, “I just wanna use the nail gun and the paint sprayer so baaad.”
kate
[Laughs.] I mean, it can be all the things, I think. [John “oooh”s.] But no, I mean, I think part of it too is I work from home. I have worked from home for a long time. I will continue to work from home for the foreseeable future. And when I have the gumption to do something and could do it quickly and have the right tools, I do just wanna pause and harken back to that like me using fabric paint thing. It was because I didn’t have the right thing that I needed in that moment, and so it resulted in this hot mess! But if you have the paint sprayer or you have the nail gun, you can efficiently and effectively do the work. You have the right tool. So, I think it’s both—yes, of course it’s very fun to have a nail gun and very fun to have a paint sprayer. And I do wanna be able to do things quickly when I am struck by the gumption to do them.
john
So, obviously you have not put a nail through your hand or any of your loved ones or anything so far. You have the nail gun. You rented the power washer. Richard, why are you holding out on the paint sprayer at this point? Aside from getting paint places where it shouldn’t be, are you concerned that Kate’s gonna accidentally turn the paint sprayer into her own eyes or something? Or—?
jean
Into your eyes?
john
What’s the worst thing that could happen with the paint sprayer?
richard
Oh, I could foresee—I can foresee many injuries potentially coming from the paint sprayer.
john
Tell me one of them, Richard. Tell me one of them.
richard
So, I don’t mean to get dark. I actually—I’ve done some research, and people have had amputations from paint sprayers.
jean
Do you mean an explosion?
richard
Oh, well that actually—that’s one I did not think of. That absolutely is possible, I think, an explosion. But no, they—if it’s—I mean, I don’t know how high powered of a paint sprayer Kate is interested in. I suspect the most powerful one. And you know, Judge, if you do ultimately grant her wish, I hope you put some parameters that limit the capacity of her paint sprayer. But—
john
Oh no, it’ll be the most powerful one. [They laugh.] What would be the point of getting anything else?
richard
No, I believe that people get—unfortunately, paint essentially injected into them, and it can lead to amputations of fingers. I’m not making this up.
jean
Richard, do you drive a car? [Richard confirms.] That’s all. [Kate and Richard laugh.]
richard
Effective. Conceded.
john
Kate, what do you got to paint? It sounds like the painting’s done. I don’t get it.
kate
Well, yeah, the painting—the painting is not done. So, actually, that room that Richard is sitting in, ideally the other side of that room would just be all white. So, it’s like got the arched ceilings. It would be all white. There’s a whole rigamarole with that, where we had to compromise on—he wanted to paint that room brown. He wanted to paint a room brown.
john
Alright, I think I’ve heard everything I need to in order to make my decision. [They laugh.]
jean
[Disapprovingly.] Richard. Richard. Not the poo room. Not the poo room. Not the poop room.
john
I’m going to my unfinished rec room. I’ll be back and I’ll make my verdict.
jean
Don’t—your rectal room. Your unfinished rectal room. [Kate and Richard groan.]
john
Richard, turn your computer around—your camera around—so I can see the other side of this room.
kate
Oh. Well, now it’s all white! ‘Cause I painted it brown. We compromised on this brown color, and so it was horrible.
jean
It was terrible.
kate
I mean, compromise brown is worse than just the first pick brown. So, then I had to like paint—
john
Hang on. Hang on. I need to remember these words, ‘cause they’re very true. “Compromise brown is always worse than first pick brown.” [They chuckle.] It’s true. That’s true!
jean
Next on Compromise Brown, Encyclopedia Brown’s cousin! [They laugh.] He just wants to make it okay!
john
That’s right! Hey, Bugs Meanie! Why don’t you split the—I don’t know what. The school taekwondo trophy in half! Then everyone can have a piece.
jean
Okay, let’s all win. Compromise Brown! Saturdays at nine. [They laugh.]
john
Always be pitching shows. You never know. You never know. So, your story’s all over the place, Kate. I’m sorry. Like—uh.
kate
Wait—wait, wait, wait, wait! It’s gonna get there, I promise.
john
But you already said that he wanted to paint it brown and then you did paint it brown, but then it’s been painting white, but you wanna paint it white again.
kate
Well, so, because I had to use the roller and then we were doing this like really silly thing—
jean
There’s a lot of brown under there. You would have to go back in with a whole primer.
kate
I re-primed it, exactly.
jean
Oh, you gotta re-prime the whole thing. And so, now that’s probably not even white. It’s just primer, ‘cause who wants to go back and do—I’m sorry, I’ve had a lot of experience painting this house and it is horrendous.
john
She sees a brown wall and she wants to paint it white. I get it! Is that the project that you want the paint sprayer for? What do you want the paint sprayer for?
kate
Well, so, that room is unfinished white. So, there are splotches. It needs to be repainted.
john
Finish that room. [Kate confirms.] One. Okay. What else?
kate
I guess I didn’t relay this to Richard. I would like to paint some furniture. I know that is—[laughs].
jean
I knew it. Yeah. Kate. Listen. I know—I get it. I see it. I understand it. Can I—Richard, do you think it might be a thing where maybe you guys, if there’s like some sort of Goodwill or thrift store, are there pieces that you would—so Kate can become more of a professional and less rash—use her paint sprayer? Some small, flipped pieces to practice on?
richard
If—absolutely. Absolutely. But I guarantee, if we had a paint sprayer, Kate is not interested in practicing. [Chuckling.] She will go—she will follow her whim, good for her. There will be no practicing.
john
Kate. Why not rent a paint sprayer? Why do you wanna own one? ‘Cause I wanna own one now. I understand, but I need you to articulate it.
kate
If you do the paint sprayer for the majority of the room that you paint, then you have more energy left. Like, my will—my gumption is a finite amount sometimes. And so, then you have the—
john
You have a project. Why don’t you rent a paint sprayer? Why do you want to buy one?
kate
I think people—I think we could be the people that repaint our home with some relative frequency! I also—
john
I can understand now why Richard is concerned. [They laugh.]
kate
I mean, not like every year. But they don’t go bad! You know? They’re just sitting there. Waiting for us.
jean
Sometimes you need to change the space! You gotta change the space.
kate
And sometimes like you move a piece of furniture and you bump the thing and then you gotta fix it.
jean
Well, that wasn’t a very good argument. That’s a paintbrush case. So. [They laugh.] Don’t—take that one out. ‘Cause I’m on your side but take that one out. Take that one out. [Kate agrees through laughter.]
john
Richard, it seems that your argument is the paint sprayer will create more opportunities for paint to be sprayed by Kate. That it will not be project oriented and once it is in the home, she will not be able to help herself, but will create more and more opportunities to use the paint sprayer, more and more projects that are disruptive and nervous-making to you. Would that be kind of your argument, there?
richard
That’s definitely one aspect of it, yes.
john
Because Kate has certainly proved that argument for you. [Richard laughs.] I absolutely agree that that’s what’s gonna happen. Richard, when you hear Kate talk about how she’s gonna repaint the house any old day of the week with this new paint sprayer, what does that—how does it make you feel, physically? Or mentally.
richard
Yeah, you know, the nervousness does manifest in some physical ways. I feel my stomach tighten. You know. There’s some uneasiness about it. Yeah. I think, you know, there are so many unknowns. And I think Kate’s giving a hint of her proclivity to some rash behavior. I think we—it could be so much more than you realize. I really do think that.
john
What do you think—I mean, again, finger amputation? [Richard laughs and struggles for words.] Your worst-case scenarios—you have a hard time articulating them. And you seem afraid to articulate them, ‘cause they’re too dark. But I am ordering you to articulate what your worst-case scenario is that you’re trying to say to Kate, “This is what you’re not thinking about, and you should think about it.” Give me an example.
richard
I could see—I mean, I think an explosion was mentioned. I definitely think that’s a potential. I think—
john
Jean Grae gave you that idea just now!
richard
Fair, fair!
jean
I gave it to him ‘cause I understood what he was thinking, ‘cause I think this is the one time I’ve been on here where I’m like, “I see myself in both of these people.” I wanted to get a paint sprayer, and the explosion was a big deal to me. And it stays in my head all the time.
richard
I would also—I mean, you know, this is not—you know, this is not life or limb threatening, but I could see a scenario where I come home and half the house is painted purple, and Kate changed her mind and will paint it a different color the next day. I could genuinely see that scenario. I mean, I could also—you know, Kate, maybe you wanna tell the story of how you almost electrocuted yourself on—I mean, there have been two occasions—
john
So ordered. So ordered.
kate
[Laughing.] Oh my god! Richard!
richard
I think there have been two occasions, but how about the—I think it was the washer plug or the drier plug one.
john
Yeah. When you have two near-electrocution stories, it’s hard to pick which one to tell. But uh, answer the question, please.
kate
[Laughs.] Oh, I’m so embarrassed. I don’t do electrical work any longer. I mean, outside of like changing light switches or things like that. [John affirms.] It was very late. We had moved into this home, and it needed a lot of work. We haven’t even—I mean, we didn’t even scratch the surface on how much work was needed. We got a washer and drier delivered. And when they delivered it—I grew up in the Midwest and I should’ve just—they offered. They were like, “We can put this plug onto your washing machine for you. And they’d already lugged it down this basement. It was like a whole mess of a thing. And I was like, “No, no, no. Don’t worry about it.”
john
‘Cause that’s a midwestern thing to do.
kate
Well, just because they had gone to so much trouble. They’d gone to so much trouble.
john
No, no, no. I’m not questioning you. I’m like let’s—I get it. Okay, yeah. [Beat.] “No, no, let me make you a hot dish, instead.”
kate
“And here’s this exorbitant tip and, yeah, a hot dish. And also, do you—” Yeah. But then the plug was the wrong plug. And so, then I was like searching for the right plug and ordering different plugs. And then I had ordered like three of the wrong plugs. Which, again, granted I will say if it were Richard, he would’ve probably researched and gotten the right plug the first or second time. So, then by this time, I’m frustrated. It’s like 11 o’clock at night. We both had been working. And I was like, “We need to have a working washing machine in this home.” And I had the thing that I thought was the right one. And so, I wasn’t gonna put it onto the washing machine that night. I just wanted to make sure that tomorrow, when I had the gumption, I had the right thing.
john
You’re talking about putting the plug onto the cable coming out of the—?
kate
Yeah, so, the cable was not connected, ‘cause we had a weird outlet at our house. And so, a new cable needed to be connected to the washing machine, which I knew how to do. But it was that I kept having—
john
Sure. Who doesn’t? [They laugh.]
kate
I kept ordering the wrong one. Like, for the plug.
john
Got it. For the outlet.
kate
For the outlet. Right.
john
So, you got a new power cable to attach to the washing machine that would fit your outlet. And when did you almost get electrocuted?
kate
Yeah, so after the third or fourth one, I just wanted to hold it up and see like, “Okay, this is the right plug.” ‘Cause clearly I keep making a mistake. Yeah, so you don’t do that, because it’s wrapped in plastic and the two ends were touching each other, and then as—you know how electricity works. If you get the plug too close to the thing, it will arc, and… explosion. So, I’m holding this thing. It arcs and it—I do—I did stumble backward. It did like pop and spark and—
jean
It was an electrocution. Yes.
kate
That’s the end of the story. That’s all. [John “hm”s.]
richard
It was a 220 right? It was a more powerful—? [Kate confirms tiredly.] And I—my recollection is you went to plug in the plug.
kate
No, I wasn’t ever gonna plug it in! It was just late at night, and I just wanted to like physically—I’m a visual person. I just wanted to physically see that it was right. And I made a mistake that has—this story has been told or requested to be told a lot.
john
It was late at night, after a beer and tequila pool destruction party, and I just wanted to plug in a plug!
jean
Judge? I have one last question. Richard, as a safety enthusiast, I assume that like before you purchase anything, you do some research and some comparative like, “Hey, this might be the safest thing to get.” Is that true?
richard
That’s generally true, yeah.
jean
Do you guys combine your powers of, “Hey, I would like this thing”, “Hey, let me see what the safest version of that might be”? Or is it normally sort of a split-up decision?
richard
I think we definitely combine our powers and I think there’s just always a tension there. I’m going for the more practical, conservative, safer version. Kate just wants power.
jean
Have you heard of the show called Compromise Brown? Which is on Saturdays at nine? [Everyone laughs.] I just—it’s of no relevance. That’s all. That’s all.
john
Is your point of view, Richard, that there is no paint sprayer safe enough to have in your home?
richard
The one that I think is safe enough—I mean, there are many versions that I think would be safe. I’m sure Kate would be dissatisfied with all of those.
john
Why would she be dissatisfied?
richard
Uh, she won’t—tell me if I’m wrong, Kate. She wants professional grade. She wants to cover a lot of surface area quickly. I don’t think she would go through the process of buying a paint sprayer if it wasn’t serious. [Chuckles.]
kate
Oh, I feel like we bought a nail gun that’s not serious. Like, it’s not a compressor connected nail gun. It’s just like a battery-operated nail gun.
jean
Oh, it’s a—it’s not a compressor! You didn’t buy one with a—
kate
It’s not a compressor.
jean
Ah. Yes, that one is too dangerous. I agree, Richard. Okay. Alright.
kate
So, I think we could find—it doesn’t have to be the most powerful. What I don’t want is it to like clog and be janky all the time. But it doesn’t have to be like—I don’t even know how they work. I obviously haven’t done the research. But like, you know, I don’t want it to spray like from ten feet away. I just wanna be able to, as the judge has so clearly said, fshh, fshh, fshh. Yeah!
john
Alright. I think I’ve heard everything I need to in order to render my judgement. I am going to go into my unfinished solarium. I’ll be back in a moment with my verdict.
jean
Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom and goes to his meringue porch. [The squeak of chairs and heavy footsteps.] Alright, Kate. And Richard. How are you both feeling about the case? Kate?
kate
Well, I feel a lot less confident after that really terrible washing machine story with the electricity.
jean
Yeah. And electrocution does tend to darken things. [They laugh.] Slightly.
kate
Um, yeah. So, not as confident as I was coming in.
jean
Richard, how are you feeling?
richard
[Chuckling.] I’m concerned. I’m concerned. I think that—I’m just looking at the possibility of Kate having another power tool and I have some concern. Yeah.
jean
And how did you guys feel about season four, episode five of Compromise Brown that just came on, yesterday? [They laugh.] Did you—did everyone watch it? Or—?
kate
I mean, season three was so much better. So.
jean
It’s true! It’s true. It was just a classic, classic episode. I guess we’ll see what the judge has to say about all this when we come back in just a moment.
sound effect
Three gavel bangs, repeated twice.
john
Hey, Jean, let’s take a quick break from the case and talk about what we have coming up. In fact, right now, if you are listening to this on June 29th, the day this podcast comes out 2022, then that means it’s not too late for you to come see not merely me, not merely Jesse, not merely Jennifer Marmor, but also the great Jean Grae at Lincoln Center for free, under the stars, in Damrosch Park June 29th, 2022. Look, I don’t know when you download this podcast. I don’t know when you listen to it. Look at your favorite map and guidance app. Put in Lincoln Center. Put in your destination. I bet you could make it. I bet you could take some public transportation, bring some friends, and come see a wonderful, free show. It’s gonna be a delight. And by the way, if you’re listening to this the next day? [Whispers.] Too late. You missed it. Don’t be the person for whom it’s too late, you missed it. That’s a terrible feeling! Be the person who knows they’re just in the nick of time. Come see us. Lincoln Center. And! It’s gonna be great. Jean, what do you have going on in this world that you might want the listeners to know about?
jean
Well, most of my projects are, uh, me having to finish stuff and edit stuff and work on things. I’m in the middle of my book, which’ll be out next year.
john
You’re writing a book?
jean
I’m writing a book! I’m composing that Steve Urkel musical that’ll be out at the end of the year, in December. So, we’re almost there.
john
Let’s just stop so everyone can process what you said. [Jean laughs.] That Steve Urkel musical, it’s not merely that! It’s a holiday—
jean
It’s a holiday—it’s called Did I Do That to the Holidays? It’s an animated feature from Warner Brothers, and it’ll be out in December. Yes! Jaleel White is back playing Steve Urkel. And also, shoutouts to Jaleel White and his role in The Hustle which was just on Netflix. He was fantastic in it.
john
Yeah! Fantastic! And you’re doing all the music for that.
jean
That’s Not How You Do That, which should be out before the end of the year.
john
So, google Jean Grae. G-R-A-E. To keep abreast of all of these projects as they come to incredible fruition. You don’t wanna miss a single one of them. And Jean, you’re still on the social media known as Instagram. [Jean confirms.] And you are @JeannieGrigio on Instagram, right?
jean
I am @JeannieGrigio. I am on Twitter, but you can’t find me. I’m just there to make sure that, when the revolution happens, I know. And I mean any of the revolutions. [Chuckles.] Any of them!
john
Any of the revolutions that are—yeah.
jean
And happy Pride still!
john
Happy Pride still! Okay, let’s get back to the case!
sound effect
Three gavel bangs.
jean
Please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom and presents his verdict. [The squeak of chairs and heavy footsteps.]
john
Airless sprayers are mechanical devices that compress a fluid coating, like paint, and force it through a small opening or spray tip. At very high fluid pressure, some reaching 5000lbs per square inch, spray from the gun, leaks, or ruptured components can inject fluid through the skin and into your body, ‘causing serious injury—including the need for amputation. I think that I found the exact public safety PDF put forward by WorkSafe New Brunswick, in Canada, the provincial OSHA of New Brunswick, Canada, that Ricard found. An employee using a high-pressure spray gun injected himself when he inadvertently put his finger in front of the spray tip. Extensive surgery and rehabilitation helped save his finger, but the incident could easily have resulted in a loss of his finger, hand, or arm. You could’ve come armed—as it were, Richard—to this courtroom with this kind of graphic, Canadian documentation. I took a chainsaw class in Maine where we got a chainsaw because we wanted to clear some small trees on our property. The only—neither of us were going to touch that chainsaw until we went to chainsaw school at our neighbor’s place. He’s a local forester. And we got all of the safety equipment, including bullet-proof chaps and a really cool helmet. And I thought we were gonna have a really fun time cutting up logs. The stories that were told about what can go wrong with a chainsaw—to you or to, for example, the toddler that comes up behind you and surprises you—they would, uh, curl your toes. If you had any left after using a chainsaw for five minutes! It’s some scary stuff, power tools. Never touched that chainsaw again. Never—that was the one time we used it. We bought it. It still sits in our garage, mostly because I’m not sure I know how to turn it on. Too scared. Too scared. But then! I learned from a neighbor about battery powered chainsaws that are very easy to turn on. You put in the battery. They don’t go [mimics the engine startup of a standard chainsaw], which is a scary noise. They basically go fshh, fshh, fshh. It’s so easy! They’re very powerful. They will—can easily kill you. But after about three years of being terrified of the chainsaw, once we got the battery—for some reason, the battery powered one, which not only makes less noise—makes less scary noise—but also stops on a dime, unlike the gasoline powered one. I started using it. And of course, the more I used it, the more proficient I became. I’m not an expert now, but I am not terrified of it. We live amidst a lot of dangerous tools. And one of the most dangerous tools is the house that you inhabit. [Chuckles.] Full of dangers, lurking behind every electrical panel. And another dangerous tool is either marriage or nonmarried cohabitation. [They chuckle.]
john
That is a tool that, when it functions well, it goes very smoothly. A lot more gets done more efficiently and pleasantly with two. But when it goes wrong, it can cause enormous damage. And in a lot of couplings, partnerships, the kind we’re talking, cohabitating partnerships that also involve hugging and kissing and sleeping in the same room, so forth. There is usually—this tool has an engine that is making it go in one direction. And then there’s often a part of the tool that is the—we’ll call it the inhibitor. The part of the chainsaw that automatically shuts the chainsaw down when it bucks back up at you so that it doesn’t cut your head off. And you need both parts of the tool for it to function. You need an engine to make it go, and you need some safety mechanisms to make sure it doesn’t cut your head off or electrocute you. Kate, to me, seems like a wonderful engine. And Richard, you seem to me like a wonderful inhibitor. You’re both doing your jobs. But I absolutely, very strongly, just by—and this unfortunate to the podcast listening audience—simply by seeing the glee and gleam in Kate’s eyes whenever she considers power tools, I absolutely believe, Richard, that she is going to take it further than you are comfortable with.
kate
[Laughs.] Oh no!
john
No, that’s good! That’s what the engine does! That’s what the engine does. Because the more you use the tool, the further you take it, the more competent and careful you become. Once you are almost electrocuted once, you don’t let it happen again. Except, you did. You know.
jean
Electrocute me once, shame on me. [Everyone chuckles.]
john
Once you’re electrocuted once, you don’t get electrocuted again. But you did, didn’t you, Kate? Didn’t you? [Kate confirms.] Which one was the clothes washer plug near-electrocution?
kate
That was the first one. Yeah.
john
Right. So, there was one after that! [Kate confirms with embarrassment.] Yeah. I think that Richard’s inhibitor instinct is correct, that—you know, the engine’s job is to leap in and go, go, go, go, go, go, go. But I think that, with these tools, a little inhibition on your own part is probably recommended. And I really wish you still had a big, concrete hole of rubble in your backyard. Because I think you got rid of it too quick. I think that that would’ve been a great place [chuckles] for Kate to power wash and paint spray and nail gun all kinds of things that shouldn’t be washed, sprayed, or nailed to figure out how it works. And wearing the proper safety equipment in an area where no one would get hurt. That would be a great place to get a bunch of junky furniture and put it in the rubble pit and then paint spray it up and get a feel for the thing that you’re working on and how the tool works. There’s so much—I really admire you, because I’ve only just begun to figure out how to plug a plug into a plug, to quote Kaspar Hauser. Like, so much that I’ve had to learn from, you know, working on this house that I cohabitate in with my partner. And also, like I had to learn how to relight a pilot light for a hot water heater, which is a thing that can explode that’s gas. And yet, these things get done. Mostly without people dying. That’s the astonishing thing. People use chainsaws all the time without dying. Proportionately more than they end up cutting off their own legs. And there is value, I think, in coming to appreciate that that happens, because it makes you less fearful in this world. But what’s part of the deal, Kate, is you gotta learn how to use these tools. You gotta go to chainsaw class, as it were, before you pick up a chainsaw. And there's gotta be a lot of paint sprayer class online. And I think that you have to be on the exact same page--well, you're never gonna be on the exact same page, ‘cause you’re two different people. But closer—you gotta—the pages of tool manual that is your relationship have to be a little closer together before you just go out and get another thing. ‘Cause here’s the deal, you overruled Richard on the brown. I agree with you. But he’s warm colors. He’s not neutral colors. He’s not cold colors. He’s warm colors Rich. That’s what I call him. Rich, warm browns. Alright? You painted over that. He didn’t want the nail gun. You got the nail gun. He didn’t want the power washer, you power washed him out of your life and got one. Your partner is being—feels painted over. I don’t know whether you really feel this way, Richard, but I think it’s a fair warning. Just because you’re the engine doesn’t mean you can paint over the inhibitor. He also lives in this home. I would dare say he deserves a brown room of his own, to paraphrase Virginia Woolf. Except brown is terrible and he shouldn’t have it.
john
Here’s what I’m gonna rule. You cannot buy a paint sprayer. Yet. [Kate laughs.] You can rent one for fun and paint some furniture with a drop cloth in the backyard. Rent one. Enjoy it. Fshh, fshh, fshh. Have fun with it. The more you use it, the more competent you’ll be with it. The more competent you are with it, the more comfortable Richard will be. And then, down the line, maybe a holiday’ll come, a birthday, maybe Richard will get you a beautiful paint sprayer. In the meantime, rent one. Get it out of your system and be careful that you, as the engine, aren’t completely overruling the inhibitor in your—in the machine that is your relationship. This is the sound of a gavel. Fshh, fshh, fshh. Judge John Hodgman rules. That is all.
jean
Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exists the courtroom. [The squeak of chairs and the sound of heavy footsteps.] Alright. Richard, Kate. Uh, as the child of both of your fears and desires, I would like to ask you how you feel about the decision.
richard
I feel tremendously relieved. And I think it’s fair. I mean, it clearly—a very thoughtful, wise judge.
kate
He already ruled. You don’t have to—
jean
It’s alright. You can lay back on it, Richard. It already happened. Kate, [laughs]—Kate, how are you feeling? You get to rent, but not exactly buy it. How do you feel about that?
kate
Yeah. Yeah. I’m happy for Richard that he prevail—I think it—I think he probably feels like he prevailed. So, I’m happy about that. Uh, I’m not a patient human, so it will be hard. But good compromise.
jean
And Compromise Brown, to everyone again, Saturdays at nine. It is also in syndication now. You can catch it on all channels just round the clock, ‘cause it’s got 25 seasons of compromising. Well, Kate and warm Rich, thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. A joy. [They thank Jean.]
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Three gavel bangs.
jean
Alriiiight! That’s another case in the books! Before we dispense some swift justice, we wanna thank Twitter user @NYCMarMar for naming this week’s episode “Hearspray”. What a pun. Congratulations. I’m very proud of you; that’s not sarcasm. [John snorts a laugh.] Evidence and photos from the show are posted on our Instagram account, at Instagram.com/judgejohnhodgman. So, make sure to follow us. Our producer is the fabulous Jennifer Marmor and editor is the beautiful Valerie Moffat. Now, let’s get to some swift justice, where we answer your small disputes with a quick judgement. Maria says, “My mother likes to save the used paper napkins after dinner. She keeps a stack of them”—oh no—“in the kitchen to mop up spills or get gunk out of the sink.” Oh no. “I think it’s gross, because people have been wiping their mouths on them. She thinks its environmentally friendly.” [Clearly horrified.]_ “Who’s right?”
john
Yeah, don’t. Don’t—oh no. That’s what I say. Oh no.
jean
[Softly.] Oh no. Oh no.
john
Oh no. Mom, no. No. “Get gunk out of the sink” is maybe the only thing that I could see using a used napkin for. [Jean gags.] But I don’t know that that’s right. Anywhere—yeah, no, you’re contaminating everything. That’s everybody’s salivas and snots. No. Sorry.
jean
[Pained.] Oh nooo. In this economy?!
john
Sorry, Maria’s mom. Maria, I side with you against your mom. Maria’s mom?
jean
[Voice cracking.] Stop. Stop it.
john
Come on. Stop. Oh no.
jean
[Whispering.] Stop it.
john
Hey, please remember to submit your cases at MaximumFun.org/jjho. No case is too big, and! No case is too small. Are there cases that are too medium? Yes. Big and small, we’ll hear ‘em all. Jean Grae, thank you so much again for being here. I know we’re gonna hear from you again next week. Very exciting! So, stay tuned everyone. Judge John Hodgman will retuuuurn! As we do every Wednesdayyy. And we’ll talk to you next time, on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.
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Three gavel bangs.
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Cheerful ukulele chord.
speaker 2
Comedy and culture.
speaker 3
Artist owned—
speaker 4
—audience supported.
About the show
Have your pressing issues decided by Famous Minor Television Personality John Hodgman, Certified Judge. If you’d like John Hodgman to solve your pressing issue, please contact us HERE.
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