TRANSCRIPT Depresh Mode Ep. 185: David Shaw of The Revivalists Finds His Heart Mode

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John Moe: Before we dive in, just a quick redirect. We are now on BlueSky, the social media platform BlueSky, @DepreshMode. We’re no longer adding new stuff to the Twitter account, or X account. X, or Twitter, became such a gross place full of cruelty and bullying and bots; it didn’t feel like a healthy place for a show like ours about honesty and vulnerability. So, on BlueSky, @DepreshMode. Find us there. Okay, the show.

It’s like we’re all in school—not high school, not college, not grad school, not grade school, but school. We’re here to learn, gather knowledge, analyze it, synthesize it. This school is called life, but you probably already knew that. And in this school, We’ve all been assigned this big research project: investigate what happened to you, figure out how it made you who you are, figure out how to manage the whole operation as best you can—given what you found out—in order to prepare yourself for what’s still to come.

Now, good news—there’s no deadline for this research project, and there are no grades. But make no mistake, it has been assigned to you, and it’s for your own good. You can do this research and keep the notes too; you don’t have to turn it into the teacher, because there is no teacher. We just ask that you do the research. You can keep your own private notebook about your past, your bumps, your lessons, your inventory of experiences. You don’t have to share it with anybody, or you could share it with the whole class. You can do an oral presentation. Our show, this show, is often a venue for people to give their oral reports.

It’s Depresh Mode. I’m John Moe. I’m glad you’re here.

Music: “Take a Look Inside” from the album Take a Look Inside by David Shaw.

I was running

I was running scared

Scared of myself

Scared of my own power

Then one day I stopped and said hello to the pain

That changed everything

 

Take flight

To wherever you want to go

In your mind

Oh yeah

Cause tonight

Whatever you want to do is alright

(Music fades out.)

 

John Moe: That’s “Take a Look Inside” by David Shaw, from his new album of the same name. And it does take a look inside, with introspective lyrics—including about David’s own mental health journey, which has included anxiety and addiction.

David is the lead singer for the rock band The Revivalists. That band is originally from New Orleans. They’ve been together since 2007, have released several albums and chart-topping singles. They have played everywhere. They’ve played at Red Rocks. They’ve appeared on Jimmy Kimmel and Conan and Ellen. They opened for the Rolling Stones multiple times.

I had a chance to talk to David about his music, his mind, his research project. I’m going to share it with the whole class. David Shaw, welcome to Depresh Mode.

David Shaw: Delighted to be here, thanks for having me.

John Moe: Those first lyrics on the first song on the new album—“I was running, I was running scared. Scared of myself, scared of my own power. And then I stopped and said hello to the pain.”

Can you tell me more about that moment? Where it was, when, what happened?

David Shaw: So, that particular song was a song that kind of spawned this entire project, honestly. For a while there, for a long time, I was just… I was running from the anxieties that I had. I was running from my—I felt like I was running from the life that I could have if I just sat down.

At the time, I thought it was going to be a fight, you know? And even now, just talking about it, it still brings up emotion. I can feel my heart raise, you know. So, I know there’s something there. You know, there’s definitely something there. I feel softer about it though now. And you know, it was just feelings of anxiety, feelings of, you know, “Am I doing the right thing?” Am I doing the right thing by myself? Am I doing the right thing by my friends, my family—my daughter, at this point?

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Now, I didn’t have a daughter then. But you know, I knew that was in the future. But I just knew that I needed to stop running. And I knew that I needed to sit down and just face this dark entity. That’s what it felt like at the time. It was like what is this darkness that is here? And let me just… let me try to get in there. And you know, my way at this point is just to be soft with it. Maybe make a friend of it, you know?

And so, what I did was, I just—I sat down in my studio for 20 to 30 minutes, and I would just sit with it. Anytime it would come up, if I was able to go out there, I would just sit with it. Then I kind of started to experiment a little bit with psilocybin and marijuana as well to kind of almost like facilitate these feelings. Because I noticed that anytime I would do something like that, I would get anxiety. It would like bring this feeling up right to the front. And I’m like, okay. But then I was doing that for a little bit and sitting with that anxiety. And then I started to kind of—my brother Zach from the band, The Revs, he had told me about a podcast on IFS.

John Moe: Internal Family Systems?

David Shaw: Internal Family Systems, exactly. And it was a really important podcast for me to listen to. So, I started to do what I kind of knew about that on myself in these sessions. I would locate the pain, I would locate the anxiety, and I would just ask what it wanted. You know? And I would thank it for its service as well. You know, because I think that’s a very important part. Because, you know, the peace to kind of—you know, coming back to healing, is that you have these protectors. We all do, you know, from these various traumas when we were kids. And they’re really good at what they do. But as we grow older, we grow out of that a little bit. Or you know, or from whatever—you know, or whatever happens. You know?

But they’re still pretty vigilant. They’re still really good at what they do and, you know, they can be a little too vigilant sometimes. So, I would—yeah.

John Moe: Yeah. So, internal family systems—if people are unfamiliar with it, this is the therapeutic approach, psychotherapy approach, that according to psychology today—and they could probably say it more succinctly than I could off the top of my head—it identifies and addresses multiple sub personalities or families within each person’s mental system. So, different wounded parts, painful emotions, anger, shame, all sorts of things. And you kind of see that as elements of yourself that form the whole.

David Shaw: Exactly. Exactly. They’re like—they see it as like different—we all have these different parts of us, and there’s like a separate—almost like a separate entity inside, which is so interesting to me.

John Moe: Yeah. Well, and what you say about anxiety, and that sort of defense mechanism, that sort of guarded thing, that makes a lot of sense. A lot of people with anxiety have this kind of hypervigilance that served them really well at some point in their life. You know, maybe when they were in danger, maybe a difficult family when they were a kid, whatever it was. But then the trick is letting go of that when you’re in a safe place. And that’s the part that eludes a whole lot of people.

David Shaw: Yeah. Exactly. From the outside view, I had it all. You know? But like inside, I was like falling apart. You know? I was like, “What is going on here? Like, this isn’t—this shouldn’t be.” (Chuckles.) You know? And you know, I’ve done a lot—I’ve just done a lot of work to get back to—there’s another line in the song where it’s like, you know, “Why you can’t see like a child?”

And I think it’s like—I think it’s important to try to, you know, see the world through the eyes of a child. You know, have that wide-eyed wonder—just, you know, get back to that. Because I think—you know, there’s a lot of peace in that. And that’s kind of where I’m at right now with that.

John Moe: How far back do you go with anxiety?

David Shaw: I think it came up in various times. You know, I had some periods of my life in elementary school and kind of in junior high when I had some bullying going on. You know, and I think that created some anxiety. It wasn’t a terrible amount, you know, but it was certainly there. And I think that was my first taste of it. I didn’t know it was anxiety at the time. You know, I didn’t—I had no name for it. I had no label for it. I just know—

[00:10:00]

I just knew that it didn’t feel good. And then I think the real dose of it was—like, I never had any performance anxiety, you know, when we started. That just really wasn’t a thing, you know. I always just felt good going out there.

John Moe: With the band, with The Revivalists.

David Shaw: Yeah, exactly. But the real dose was when people started to take notice. And now it’s like, okay, now you’ve got all these eyes on you, and you’ve got to bring it every night. And it’s funny, because people say like, “Oh man!” When I talk about this stuff, they’re like, “I can’t believe you still get anxiety.”

And I’m like, “Well, actually it’s the opposite for me.” I didn’t have any anxiety when we started. It was only really until. You know, there was eyes, and you’re playing to 5,000 people every night, and everybody’s got their cell phone out, and everything is documented. And you know, it’s just like one slip, and you’re all over the internet or whatever, you know?

So, it just became this like— That was also something I was running from, you know? Because I felt like, “Man, I gotta keep this train on the tracks here.” Feeding a lot of mouths, you know? It’s just like—it’s just a lot of pressure. It’s a lot of pressure. And it took—and I think that feeling kind of—that was a tough one. That was a tough one to deal with. I think I’m—to tell you the truth, man? (Chuckling.) I’m just kind of like turning that corner.

John Moe: How did it manifest, that anxiety? Like, did it translate to anything you were doing onstage, or was it more of an offstage thing, or how did it show up for you?

David Shaw: So, the way that it showed up for me was that I started to have this condition called hyperacusis, where— Have you heard of that?

John Moe: So to speak, yes, I’ve heard of that. (Chuckling.) That’s where you’re extremely sensitive to sound, especially kind of kind of sharp sounds.

David Shaw: Sharp sounds, and also I actually—low frequencies as well. Like, hyper-low frequencies, like the bass frequencies. It was like both ends of the spectrum, basically. And it started to show up at that—probably around 2017/18, right kind of when the song “Wish I Knew You” kind of exploded. That was when it all kind of started. And like looking back at it now, I’m like, “Oh my god! Like, wow.”

And so, that was the real—so, basically there was like two years there where I was still doing shows, and I had to like keep my ears like— I couldn’t hear anything. I could barely—I couldn’t—and I had my in-ears in, but they were at like volume one, where like I was hearing really nothing. ‘Cause I couldn’t turn it up loud. You know?

John Moe: So, were you not hearing even your own voice when you sang? Because that’s a big part of singing on stage.

David Shaw: Barely. Barely, barely. Thankfully I made it through. But honestly, like looking back now, I don’t think I’d do that to myself at this point. I just feel like—you know, I think I’m still—you know, I’m paying for that in some ways, you know.

John Moe: What did you think was going on?

David Shaw: I had no idea. Honestly, I thought—you know, I thought, “Wow. Like, this is just—you know, this is just what you get for playing in a rock and roll band.” You know, it’s just like this is what happens. You know? I thought—you know, and then in the back of my mind, it’s like, my career is over. You know? This is done, it’s done. You know?

And so, I was just like—you know, for two years, I’m just slowly going down. You know, it’s not really getting any better. I’m going to all these doctors. I’m flooding my ears with white noise and brown noise and pink noise. I had to put—I had to wear hearing aids for 16 hours a day for 8 months, flood my ears with white noise. Because that’s like the treatment for hyperacusis. It’s like the volume knob gets stuck, and you have to retrain your brain to basically say that like this sound is okay.

John Moe: To tolerate it.

David Shaw: Exactly. So, it was my brain basically saying, “You need to get out of this situation!”

Transition: Spirited acoustic guitar.

John Moe: Back in just a minute with more from David Shaw. As we go to break, here’s more from David’s album, Take a look Inside. The song is “Come Back Home”.

Music: “Come Back Home” from the album Take a Look Inside by David Shaw.

On the freeway

I could see you smiling at me from that keychain

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Doing ninety miles an hour on the open road

Humming that Springsteen song

Playing on the late-night radio

In the fast lane

(Music fades out.)

 

Transition: Gentle acoustic guitar.

John Moe: Back with singer songwriter David Shaw.

So, what happened after two years? Did things get better? Did that treatment work? Did the anxiety go away?

David Shaw: So, the pandemic hit, 2020 hit. And I was forced to get off the road. And it was so important. It was like—honestly, I don’t—you know, and I want to speak softly about this, because it was a really terrible time for so many people. But it was, you know, so imperative for me to get off the road. I don’t know if I would have gotten off the road, because I’m—you know, I want to say yes. Even sometimes to my own detriment, you know what I’m saying? And I know now that like if I’m not being honest with myself about those kinds of things, (stammering) you’re going to pay the piper at some point. You know?

So, the pandemic hit in 2020; I was off the road. Now I’m sitting at home, and I’m able to kind of like start to really understand what’s going on. I had also realized it was some of the things that I was eating that were really, really causing me some issues as well.

John Moe: Like what?

David Shaw: Well, somehow along the line, I developed an egg allergy. So, once I realized that I cut out gluten as well, ‘cause I think that was, you know, contributing to the state of inflammation that I was in. ‘Cause like when you’re—you know, when you’re basically—when you’re going against your body’s will, and you’re just not listening to what it’s telling you, it’s going to start shutting down on you. It’s going to start doing certain things to kind of like get you out of whatever situation you’re in. And you know, that’s how a lot of these autoimmune diseases kind of crop up. It’s in people that—it’s in people-pleasing people. That’s like—there’s a lot of studies on that that it’s like this is where these things come from.

It’s like people abandon themselves, and they think it’s for the greater good. But it’s like you have to also put yourself in that circle, you know, of love and of life. You know? And if you’re in that chain, and your link’s falling apart—well, at some point it’s going to fall apart too. So, you got to keep it strong.

So, anyway, 2020 hit. I was off the road, and I got a chance to sit with some of this stuff and figure out, you know, my body. And I slowly, you know, started to get better. And I slowly started to realize, okay. And that was when I started doing, you know, some of these meditations on the song. And I slowly started—my ears slowly started to get better. You know, I was eating the right things, I was taking care of myself, I was exercising. But at the same time, you know, someone like me, who has definitely addict tendencies, I was starting to feel really, really good. And that’s always the most dangerous place for me. Because I go, “Oh, you’re feeling good. Well, maybe you can handle this thing. Maybe you can handle that thing. Maybe you can do a little bit of this, you know, or a little bit more of this.”

You know, it’s like, as I go up the mountain, I’m just constantly at the edge. I’ve never had a safe space. That’s the way I felt at that point. I don’t necessarily feel that anymore, you know? But that was like—that was always my analogy for like feeling good. It was like I always felt like, “Oh, I’m just like tiptoes on the edge here.”

John Moe: So what was your relationship with substances? You mentioned addiction. Has that been an ongoing kind of parallel challenge along with the anxiety throughout all this?

David Shaw: Yes. Yes, for sure. I cut out alcohol and cocaine and some of the other things that I was doing in 2009. I had a really, really bad experience. And it was—you know, it was clear to me that that was no good for me. But then, you know—since then, I was completely sober for four or five years. And then slowly, you know, I would start, you know—

[00:20:00]

I’d relapse here and I’d relapse there. And then I was relapsing all the time, you know. And it was just creating this shame in thought as well. Now I understand where I—you know. And I just—actually, part of this album, it was kind of like coming clean to all my friends and family and fans that this was also a part of me. You know, ’cause like forward-facing, I’m like the sober guy. You know? And I wasn’t all the time. You know, I wanted to be. I presented as such. But in the dark corners, sometimes—you know I’m only human. You know what I’m saying? So, I was self-medicating. You know, and that’s—it’s just all a response to pain. You know, it’s just a pain response. It’s an attempt to get some relief.

John Moe: Did that fact that you were presenting one way and actually living a different way—did that compound that anxiety? That kind of imposter syndrome thing that you were talking about?

David Shaw: Absolutely. 100%. It was definitely not making anything better. So, once I let go of that and just let that cat out of the bag, that was like an incredible weight off my shoulders. You know, I never wanted to tell anyone that. I just—you know, I just felt like such a fraud. I just felt like such a—you know, just a loser or whatever, you know? That I’m just like—

You know, but now I just realize, I just know that like I’m loved. It’s okay; we’re all human. I was—and it was all just—it’s always all just—it’s never a response to— Even in those acts, even in doing that kind of thing, it was still in love. You know, it was still an act of love. It was still a response to like heal something, you know. But not necessarily doing it the right way, just a misguided attempt.

John Moe: You’ve become a husband and a father, and congratulations on both fronts.

David Shaw: Thank you!

John Moe: When did that happen in this timeline of yours?

David Shaw: That happened about a year ago. She’s about to be a year, on the 30th of this month, November.

John Moe: And then how long have you been married?

David Shaw: I’ve been married since ‘22. But we’ve been together—but we’ve been together since 2013. So, (inaudible) a long time.

John Moe: Yeah, yeah. How did becoming a dad, especially—because you talk about this sort of, you know, period of great anxiety and kind of going through some of these thought processes and addressing some of the nutrition aspects of it. How did becoming a dad affect your mental health? Affect your anxiety and your substance issues?

David Shaw: It affected them in a positive way. First—you know, at first there was like the initial, “Oh god, okay.” You know, like here comes the wave. And I sat with that, meditated on it. I’m happy to say I didn’t go the other way. You know, I didn’t start numbing out. Because I know that’s also a thing that I can do, but I knew that that was not right.

John Moe: Defense mechanism.

David Shaw: Exactly! Another defense mechanism. I knew that that wasn’t the way. You know, I’ve been there, done that. And it only made the loop longer, you know, to get back to whole. And I just knew that I needed to be strong and in a good state of mind, for my daughter and for my wife—who is at home with our daughter right now, while I’m out working on the road for the past three-and-a-half weeks, you know? So, she’s essentially a single mom right now, you know? I’m there as much as I can, but I just knew that I had to stand up and get completely right and really just like, you know, step into my love and step into my power and step into my heart mode.

John Moe: What does that mean, heart mode?

David Shaw: (Chuckling.) It’s funny. So, I just listened to something yesterday, and this guy was talking about that we’re hardwired for heart mode. And it really resonated with me, because that is the thing that I—it’s like, I’d never like necessarily put a label on that, but it’s like I know when I’m in a heart mode, you know? Like, I know when I’m there, and it’s just a special feeling. It’s not an egotistical feeling; it’s not a— You know, it’s just a—it really does—it’s like there is a knowing there for me.

[00:25:00]

And probably, I think for—honestly, I feel like everyone. I don’t know. When you know when you’re in—you know when you’re in heart mode, and I feel like that is our default. Throughout—you know, there’s always these things that kind of take us out, pull us out of heart mode. I’m doing a lot of work to stay there. (Laughs.)

John Moe: Well, yeah, you’ve talked about many of the things that were taking you out of a heart mode previously, with the pressures of the career and everything that you’re facing. How do you get back to heart mode? I think this is a news-you-can-use kind of thing for some of our listeners. How do you personally, David, get back into that place?

David Shaw: It’s acts of service. You know, it’s really just like, you know, stepping into your own love. It’s stepping into the love that you have for others and just getting out of your own way and just trying—you know, just doing things that you can do to—

Honestly, the thing that really just kind of gets me there is acts of service, but I want to—there is an asterisk by that. Because you also have to take into consideration yourself in those acts of service. You know what I’m saying? It’s not necessarily just giving to no end. Giving and giving back and being in that mode, that gets me out of myself. It gets me out of my ego. It gets me out of this way of being that is, you know, guarded.

John Moe: Right. It seems like—from what I’m hearing, it’s not that you’re in a position now where all your problems are solved, you don’t have to worry about this anymore. But you’ve got some—you’ve glimpsed some places to try to return to that are giving you some strength and some recovery and some relief from some of the things you’ve dealt with. It’s an ongoing journey, of course.

David Shaw: It always is. It always is. But I feel—yeah, I’m definitely getting better at understanding my own, you know, psyche and my own path and the triggers that I have. Triggers are a big one.

Transition: Spirited acoustic guitar.

John Moe: More of my talk with David Shaw just ahead. And here’s some more of his music off his new album. It’s a song called “When You Love Somebody”, and pay attention, because it comes up in the next segment of the interview.

Music: “When You Love Somebody” from the album Take a Look Inside by David Shaw.

Every now and then I drive all by myself

Just to feel I’m moving

Windows down and music loud, ’cause I need help

To drown out what I’m losing

(Music fades out.)

 

Promo:

Music: A fun, percussive synth beat.

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Manolo: Number one is that it’ll inspire you. You’re gonna be like, “Oh, I could do that.”

Jo: That’s all we have time for, but you’ll just have to find Dr. Gameshow and Maximum Fun to find out for yourself.

(Music fades out.)

 

Promo:

Music: Festive synth.

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(Music fades out.)

 

Transition: Gentle acoustic guitar.

John Moe: We’re back with David Shaw.

And so, now you have this new album out. And it seems like a real—I don’t know if it’s a manifesto, but it’s a real reflection on a lot of the work that you’ve been doing on yourself and for the sake of your family. What was it like to take the enormity of all this that you’ve been dealing with and try to translate it into verse-chorus-bridge, come up with rhymes for it and everything?

[00:30:00]

David Shaw: Yeah, that’s a great question. Yeah. Sometimes it’s easy. Sometimes it’s like, oh, wow, okay. I don’t necessarily want to—I want to get away from this feeling, you know. Or I want to go into this feeling. I want this song to teach me something.

I mean, the first thing I’ll bring up, honestly, is the song “When You Love Somebody”. It really came from, you know, going to couples therapy with my wife and the things that that can kind of bring up in a relationship. You know, we took—you know, when you’re with somebody for 10 years, 12 years, you got a lot of stuff under the rug. You know, and so we went in there, and we were both just completely open, and we put it all on the table.

And I talked about some things that I never thought I would say to her, and vice versa. And it got—you know, it got pretty rough there for a little while. At no point do I think we were in jeopardy of not making it, you know, but it definitely put a strain on our relationship for a time.

John Moe: The therapy did?

David Shaw: The therapy did for sure. ‘Cause it was just like, we’re—you know, now we’re like talking about all these things, getting all this stuff out that we normally—you push things down, and you don’t talk about the things that you necessarily should maybe talk about. So, we have—you know, it gave us a—we were doing what is called imago in couples therapy, where you kind of mirror what the other person is saying, and you let them know that you understand. You understood what they’re saying. And then you kind of level with them. And it’s like this process of like going back and forth.

Because I think a lot of times in arguments, everybody—you’re just waiting for your chance to speak. You’re not actually listening to the other person. And I think that is such an important piece. I mean, it’s like everything. If you could just hear somebody, if you could just listen to them, if you could just understand where they’re coming from, you probably wouldn’t feel the way you felt. Or at least it would lower your trigger, or lower your response. Now you have compassion. You know?

But if you don’t hear them, how can you even access that? So, it was a really, really important piece. And that’s where that song, “When You Love Somebody”, came from. But yeah, you know. There’s definitely a lot of (chuckling and stammering)—a lot of different vibes on this album.

John Moe: How did your wife feel about you taking some of the stuff that you went through in couples therapy and putting it on an album?

David Shaw: You know, she’s pretty open too. You know, we’ve talked about those kind of things. She’s like—you know, she does say—she’s like, “Now, don’t you be out there telling stories.” You know?

(John laughs.)

Like, I’m not embellishing. I’m just telling it like it is. And that’s that. And she’s a therapist herself. You know? So, like she’s pretty versed in this kind of thing. And she knows the deal. But yeah, that was definitely a conversation we had to have.

John Moe: Yeah. (Laughs.) That’s an important talk to have. Well, what’s it like, you know—and are you on tour now as we’re speaking?

David Shaw: I’m on tour, yes. I’m in a (inaudible). Yep.

John Moe: You’re on tour. Okay, so—and are you playing these—? You must be playing some of these songs from this new album. What’s it like to kind of go out, you know, in front of strangers and open your heart and get to this stuff that sounds like it’s very, very personal? It’s coming from a very personal and vulnerable place. What’s it like to present that in a music venue?

David Shaw: It’s a release. It’s a release every time, you know. It’s a release for the fans as well, and that is when I really understand, and that kind of like puts me—as I realize that, you know, and I keep my eye on that part as well, that is also what kind of like gets me in heart mode and keeps me there. You know, because I realize it’s like, this is also—this isn’t just about me at all. You know, these songs are connecting with these people in real time, and we’re doing some really good work out there and healing.

I mean, I’ll also just bring up—you know, I’m also playing our song, “Soulfight” every night. It’s a song that I wrote when I was 22. So, and that is—you know, that’s always a fan favorite. You know. And they’re always super happy to hear that one. But I think it’s not just—it’s because the song, it’s like it just means so much. I mean, it means so much to me, but it’s like, there’s—you know, like I’m playing it, and there’s people crying in the front row, and I’m like—

[00:35:00]

Like, that’s why I do this. Right here. You know, they’re like holding each other, and you can just tell, it’s like—it’s deep. And that used to honestly scare me a little bit. ‘Cause I’m like, “What is happening here?!” You know? It kind of was like, “Oh gosh, okay.” But I understand now that this is what needs to happen. This is your acts of service, Dave. This is what’s going on here.

John Moe: Yeah. What are your goals then? Having put out this album and kind of having—you know, not solved all your mental health issues, because it is a journey, but at least feeling like you’re on the right road. What are your personal goals for yourself? Not so much about the music or—you know, but what’s your goal for you?

David Shaw: My personal goals are to just, you know, follow my joy. Understand—and just like understand that, you know, it’s not always going to be easy. And you know, sometimes you’ve got to make the hard decision. And I just want to continue to grow and continue to, you know, step into my truth and step into who I really am and who I’m becoming.

Because I think we’re always—we’re just beings of change. And beings of change and truth. And I think we deny a lot of that a lot of times, whether it’s just like doing something someone else wants you to do, or— I think we’ve got to—and it’s also like— I’m just gonna say this again. It’s like staying in heart mode. Whatever I can do at this point to keep me there, that’s what I’m going to do, because I know that—for me—that’s what’s going to change my life. That’s what’s going to be best for the lives of people around me. And that’s what’s going to, you know, get me to the next level of… you know, for lack of a better word, enlightenment. You know?

(Chuckling.) Like, I don’t know if that’s ever a thing that you reach, but through—you know, through acts of service and through just like, you know, being in my truth and trying to stay in heart mode.

(Music fades in.)

John Moe: Alright. The album is Take a Look Inside. We’ve been speaking with David Shaw, who’s coming to us from both his tour and from—I think—his heart mode, which is a good place to conduct an interview from. David, thank you so much.

David Shaw: Thank you, John. It was amazing to be here and speak with you. Thanks for having me.

John Moe: Here’s another of the songs that David talked about from his new album. This is “Soulfight”.

Music: “Soulfight” from the album Take a Look Inside by David Shaw.

Isn’t anybody home in here?

It’s getting cold, and I just don’t care, so I’m

Gonna find something else to do, uh-huh

Just take a really good look at me

I’m 22, and I still don’t see why

All of you people can’t get along anymore

‘Cause falling down ain’t so hard to do

Your only crutch be the bottle of brew

So, I’m gonna find something else to do, uh-huh

(Music fades out.)

Music: “Building Wings” by Rhett Miller, an up-tempo acoustic guitar song. The music continues quietly under the dialogue.

John Moe: We exist because people want us to exist. We try to get the show out in the world where it can help people, where it can help you understand your mind, where it can make you feel less alone. We think that’s a good cause. If you think so too, please support it so we can keep making shows. It’s easy to do. Just go to MaximumFun.org/join, find a level that works for you. That’s up to you—five bucks a month, ten bucks a month, whatever it is—and then select Depresh Mode from the list of shows. That’s all there is to it.

And we really appreciate your support. If you’ve already supported the show. Thank you. You are helping make the show possible, and you are helping folks. Be sure to hit subscribe. Give us five stars, write rave reviews. That helps get the show out into the world as well.

The 988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline can be reached in the US and Canada by calling or texting 988. It’s free. It’s available 24/7.

We’re on BlueSky, @DepreshMode. Our Instagram is @DepreshPod. We are on Substack also.

[00:40:00]

Search up the Depresh Mode newsletter there. I’m on BlueSky and Instagram, @JohnMoe. Join our Preshies group over on Facebook. A lot of good people hanging out there, sharing their thoughts, sharing support for one another, insights all over the place. It’s a good place to hang out. I hang out there too. I’ll see you there. Please use our electric mail address, DepreshMode@MaximumFun.org.

Hi, credits listeners. See the movie Hundreds of Beavers, but only if you want to laugh a lot and have a very good time. It’s available on Tubi, T-U-B-I, for free.

Depresh Mode is made possible by your contributions. Our production team includes Raghu Manavalan, Kevin Ferguson, and me. We get booking help from Mara Davis. Rhett Miller wrote and performed our theme song, “Building Wings”. Depresh Mode is a production of Maximum Fun and Poputchik. I’m John Moe. Bye now.

Music: “Building Wings” by Rhett Miller.

I’m always falling off of cliffs, now

Building wings on the way down

I am figuring things out

Building wings, building wings, building wings

 

No one knows the reason

Maybe there’s no reason

I just keep believing

No one knows the answer

Maybe there’s no answer

I just keep on dancing

 

Jackson: Hi, this is Jackson from Minneapolis. We’re gonna get through this together.

(Music fades out.)

Transition: Cheerful ukulele chord.

Speaker 1: Maximum Fun.

Speaker 2: A worker-owned network.

Speaker 3: Of artist owned shows.

Speaker 4: Supported—

Speaker 5: —directly—

Speaker 6: —by you!

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